Shots Fired: A Machinist Guide

[Lavieh]

For those comparing the 2xGR opener and the single GR opener, you can't just say "You get two GR's vs. One". More like you get roughly a half of a GR, meaning that this is only 50% effective. You'd have to end a fight on that 10 second timeline in order to gain any benefit from using GR first.

You also need to consider the rough .5 second delay that you are delaying your first GCD.

So basically we are comparing 50% of a GR vs. 25% of your average GCD potency. It is roughly 90 Potency vs. ~46 Potency (average GCD potency).

We should also compare the potencies of the fully buffed GR vs. The GR with only half buffs.

Pre-Pop GR would have: (180 * 1.2(IADII) * 1.3(GB) * 1.1(B4B) * 1.15(HE) * 1.2(RS)) = 426 Potency
Not Full buffed GR w/ WF : (180 * 1.2(IADII) * 1.3(GB) *1.05 (HS) * 1.05(HC))/.9 (Piercing) = 343 *1.25 = 429.975

vs.

Fully buffed GR : (180 * 1.2(~Dex pot) * 1.2(IADII) * 1.3(GB) * 1.1(B4B) * 1.15(HE) * 1.2(RS) * 1.05(HS) * 1.05(HC))/.9 (Piercing) = 626.59 * 1.25 (WF) = 783 Potency



From here, we just need to add the two GR's to get their overall value. Then take the fully buffed GR, add half of a GR and add 1/4th of your average GCD. We can then compare the values to see what is better.


429 + 426 = 855(2x GR) vs. 783 + 90 + 44 = 917(1xGR)

So 1x GR may still be better. I would need to put it into a spreadsheet to see exactly which one is better.

[Greywolfamakir]

Lots of people viewing the document so far. Any and all feedback on it is appreciated so feel free to let me know what we would like changed or what you guys want different. A lot of the initial information is from the first page guide and I will be working to customize it and change up some of the formatting.

I found something "bad" in the BiS list.
Head slot, BiS list pick Machinist's Goggles, when Gordian Hood Of Aiming is better by far.

[Haxetc]

I found something "bad" in the BiS list.
Head slot, BiS list pick Machinist's Goggles, when Gordian Hood Of Aiming is better by far.

Good job on posting any reason why you think that. How about you explain how 21 crit beats 58 sks.

[Griffeth]

I found something "bad" in the BiS list.
Head slot, BiS list pick Machinist's Goggles, when Gordian Hood Of Aiming is better by far.

Its the same dex, a 17 crit difference and I do not believe we need the accuracy so that is wasted as far as the itemization budget goes.

[Lavieh]

Its the same dex, a 17 crit difference and I do not believe we need the accuracy so that is wasted as far as the itemization budget goes.

You need roughly 640 accuracy to meet the AS4 frontal accuracy cap. The build listed in the guide for 3.05 is the perfect BiS build we should be going for. You can eat Baked Pipira for AS4 and Morel Salad for every other turn.

[Ryaz]

While obviously not as important, I wish there was a BiS list for those of us who can't do Savage for some reason or other (like working 7 days a week).

[KilluaKhan]

hey jus a few questions as a nub machinist..which stats are better for secondary stats (det,crit,ss)? i ask this for the best food to take...does det affect damage with GB on? , crit i like seeing high crit hits but i dont know exact numbers, and ss ive noticed for my WF burst..i seem to be able to fit in a extra attack. but i dont know which is more effecient for duration of fight.

also another question is after looking at most rotations posted here..i wanna ask why do u guys pre buff everything before even pull? doesnt that waste secs per buff..like lets use A1S for example..even correctly lined up wit tanks pull..you running up during buffs stilll wastes the time pressing buttons n moving..but im on ps4 so i dont know if its easier for pc to do that.
- also, since alot of people agree that weakest buff first towards strongest buff for maximum WF output, then why isnt hot shot first? since its only 5% and it also lasts the longest, so you will have full effect till end, only diff is non buffed HS, but you can add in another GCD, even split or able to complete the 2nd slug or clean shot in time.
- also i dont know too much about turret auto attacks, but do they attack when you attack or when tank pulls? if it only atacks what you attack then your first move should always be a attack.
- regarding to that too, do people have GB on in beginning? if so, i dont get why, especiailly if your just using buffs, wouldn't it be better to let yourself do 1-2 AA dmg during buffing time than to start off with GB.
-since thats quite a bit of questions..i dont know if this would be a prefered starter since i dont know much of the question mechanics.
but.. [ GB OFF, tank pulls, hot shot, buffs(during this time your turret and you AA will be attacking too if the turret question was when you attack), as your buffs are going off, your AA will increase too up till the point you need to do lead shot, then GB b4 LS --> standard rotation] based on my own testings on ps4, it seems this way im able to fit my entire rotation w/ buffs ending like literally last shot..but if i had GB / hotshot..then it wouldnt get to the last slug or clean..but could also be a latency? i dunno..i have a macro to swap me to a completely new set jus for rotation going with everything thing in order... (pretty much like pressing 1-10 on controller)

TLDR shorter questions
#1 - best secondary stat between crit,det,SS
#2 - Why prebuff before even hitting the boss?
#3 - GB in beginning or during buffing stage?
#4 - Why not use hotshot first since its longest buff duration?
#5 - do turrets attack only when you attack or when tank engages?

[Myon88]

#2, You're wasting seconds of buffs no matter when you use them, it's unavoidable because we just have so many buffs to activate.

Consider these two sequences,

BFB, HE, RS, Boss pull
Hot Shot, Potion...

Boss pull, BFB, HE, RS
Hot Shot, Potion...

Whenever you use Hawk Eye, you're 'wasting' one GCD of BFB's uptime to cast it, this is unavoidable. When you use Raging Strikes, you're wasting one GCD of BFB and Hawk Eye's uptime to cast it too. You get the same benefit to your damage outpit from the buffs in all cases, 20 seconds of Raging Strikes, 19 seconds of Hawk Eye, and 18 seconds of BFB (roughly). It doesn't change whether you do it before the pull or afterwards.

However, by doing it before the fight, at least you don't lose out on DPS on boss while enrage timers are ticking down. In the second case, you just spent 3 seconds of the enrage timer doing no DPS and just casting buffs, while in the former case you can start actually hitting the boss much quicker.

It's like running a marathon - putting your shoes on is gonna take 10 seconds no matter what, and it doesn't give you credit toward completion. Would you rather do it before the race or after the starting gun has fired?

#5, Turrets don't attack until you yourself attack, or something hits you and turns on "battle mode". So before the pull, you can cast it near the boss and it won't aggro the boss.

[KilluaKhan]

hm ok then, if turret doesnt attack untill you attack, then wouldnt it be better to start off attacking with hot shot first? without gb, as you do buff rotation, you are auto attacking while ur turret is attacking too, so realisticallly you arent wasting anytime jus standing there, buffing right after firs hotshot gives u AA n turret attack which is a GCD with the buffs. and also extends ur buffs to the end of the WF


im sorry about inproper sentencing spacing, not too good with eng formatting, but i meant to say, start hotshot first without GB instead of buffing everything during or for hotshot can actually benefit your last "slug or clean" shot more due to the cast time u didnt spend on hotshot.

[Myon88]

hm ok then, if turret doesnt attack untill you attack, then wouldnt it be better to start off attacking with hot shot first?

If I understand this right, in this case you'll just be achieving the same thing as the method that casts buffs during the pre-pull period.

You start attacking the moment the boss is pulled too, but because you haven't casted any buffs yet, you have to do this GB-off thing to try and weave autoattack/turret damage in while casting your buffs. You can also turn GB-off for the first Hot Shot for the buff during pre-pull method, so that's an advantage both can use.

Also, those GCDs that you spend casting buffs aren't free too (even though you might be DPSing inbetween them). Reason being that someone who has already casted those buffs beforehand, can use those periods to weave damaging ogcds instead - allowing them to put things on cooldown faster, and cycle through the first use of them faster.

I suppose you could argue that if you activate them during the pre-pull period, by the time the boss is actually pulled and you attack, the first buff only has 17 seconds left, the second has 18 seconds, and so on. But activating them on the go will let autoattacks and turret shots benefit immediately from the 20s mark.

It's a bit more complicated than this though, because apart from Hot Shot, there isn't anything else in the opener you want GB to be off for. Definitely not Lead Shot, and all your 1-2-3 combo weaponskills are instant with procs from Reload/Quick Reload.