Shots Fired: A Machinist Guide

[Judge_Xero]

Had some time today to retest the Turret attack frequency while changing the Skill Speed stat. Since I wanted to see the difference over a longer period than a couple minutes.

2.64 Weapon Delay - 354 SPD
10 Minutes (600 seconds)
186 Hits
2.48 Weapon Delay - 720 SPD
10 Minutes (600 seconds)
186 Hits

Unless the effect is even lower than what SMN pets benefit, I don't think Turret is effected at all by SPD.

[Lavieh]

Had some time today to retest the Turret attack frequency while changing the Skill Speed stat. Since I wanted to see the difference over a longer period than a couple minutes.

2.64 Weapon Delay - 354 SPD
10 Minutes (600 seconds)
186 Hits
2.48 Weapon Delay - 720 SPD
10 Minutes (600 seconds)
186 Hits

Unless the effect is even lower than what SMN pets benefit, I don't think Turret is effected at all by SPD.

Seems to be the case. I would assume this would be SKS at around the .7 - .8 Point for stats, but we will see once Dervy finishes compiling his information.

SMN and MCH seem like the worst to get data for.

[Ephier]

Seems I do not need to do the 20 min version then. \o/

[Griffeth]

So how are people enjoying the Google Doc format? Any feature requests or changes you guys would like made?

[Aiurily]

i'd fix the single target 2 ammo opener, and personally i'd rule out the double GR opener entirely for most cases

buff order for single target opener is written as bfb>he>rs>hc; it should be HE+BFB>HC>RS. putting RS 3rd means you lose it for 1 GCD during wildfire; putting HC 4th does not get you any benefits over putting it 3rd

double GR opener

pros
GR and QR on CD earlier
hypercharge after GR gets you effectively half a turret auto for free because of turret auto reset
your DRG is guaranteed effectively to get disembowel up before your reassemble clean shot because of GCD delay

cons
2nd GR in wildfire isn't buffed at all. it's missing bfb, he, rs, xpot. 1st GR is missing xpot too.
you delay your GCD on pull by 2s compared to pre casting hotshot in the single GR opener, since you have to do GR on pull->delay GCD by 0.5s with HC->1.5s cast on hotshot

--

for the 2 ammo opener, an alternative route, if your drg is slow on disembowel for various reasons and its not up for clean reassemble, you can simply do 121 323 1 instead of the normal 123 121 3

split wildfire - slug qr+rapid - split reassemble - clean rico - slug gr - clean hg etc

[Myon88]

buff order for single target opener is written as bfb>he>rs>hc; it should be HE+BFB>HC>RS. putting RS 3rd means you lose it for 1 GCD during wildfire; putting HC 4th does not get you any benefits over putting it 3rd

To expand on this, the reason HC is the 3rd buff activated during the pre-pull is because that is the earliest you can activate it and still get the maximum utility from it (5 charged shots).
BFB, HE, HC, RS, Tank pull, Hot Shot...

If you activate Hypercharge and have the turret immediately attack, you'll notice you get your 5th charged shot on the ~13th second of the buff, and the last 2 seconds of the buff don't do anything at all because it drops off before you would have gotten your 6th shot on the ~16th second. To get a clear picture of this, just go to a target dummy and watch the buff on the turret for yourself, while counting the charged shots it fires during Hypercharge.

When you pre-activate HC as above you're basically frontloading that 2 seconds of wasted time, and if you go to a target dummy and look at the buff closely, you'll see you now get your 1st charged turret shot on the ~3rd second of the buff, and that last 5th shot comes right on the 15th second just as it drops off. This deactivation timing is also favourable because when Hypercharge drops off right as the turret fires its last charged shot, it immediately resets the attack swing and causes it to fire a normal shot.

However, because the timing is so tight, it is critical you make sure you're getting that first Hot Shot off ASAP to put yourself into combat and cause the turret to attack. For example, if your tank is slow to pull after you've popped your buffs, or the tank pulled and you didn't Hot Shot fast enough.

I'm sure you can see why this is bad, if you do the sequence normally you already barely get that 5th charged shot in before the buff drops off. If you're slow to get into combat on top of that, it means you'll get your first turret shot later than normal, and you're definitely not going to get that 5th charged turret shot now as Hypercharge will fall off before that happens. You lose 1 charged shot worth of damage, your raid gets less vulnerability uptime as that 5th shot would have refreshed the debuff on the boss, and you lose the favourable deactivation timing for a further DPS loss.

Again, these things are best seen in person - go to a dummy, pop your pre-pull sequence of buffs and see how long you can wait before entering combat, before you only get 4 charged shots instead of 5 under Hypercharge.

[Griffeth]

i'd fix the single target 2 ammo opener, and personally i'd rule out the double GR opener entirely for most cases

buff order for single target opener is written as bfb>he>rs>hc; it should be HE+BFB>HC>RS. putting RS 3rd means you lose it for 1 GCD during wildfire; putting HC 4th does not get you any benefits over putting it 3rd

Went ahead and update with this.

[Asura-Edge]

So the best stats for Mch in order is Dex > Crit > Determination > Skill speed ?

i was thinking Skill speed is nice because u can shot more while your target is under Wlidfire, but it seems bad choice.

Someone could tell me the 3.05 BiS (before Alexandre savage) please ?

[Ryaz]

So the best stats for Mch in order is Dex > Crit > Determination > Skill speed ?

i was thinking Skill speed is nice because u can shot more while your target is under Wlidfire, but it seems bad choice.

Someone could tell me the 3.05 BiS (before Alexandre savage) please ?

The problem with skill speed is that with too much, you start clipping your oGCDs and though it does let you pack more into WF, the amount it would take to get another shot in there would be quite a bit and not worth the return. You'd be looking at 25% of one shot every 90 seconds and something like crit or det would provide much better returns, as the extra damage each provides would be factored into WF as well.

[CarnivalNights]

Is this guide still the comprehensive and best possible MCH guide?

I've seen a few other things (Reddit) that go against this.