What's up with the defeatist attitude ?

[Whiteroom]

The funny times are where the person who causes the wipes is the person who gets angry at everyone else, posts some comment about everyone sucking and quits.

[Aoxaviar]

I have personally seen all the angles you guys are putting up, and there is truth in all of them:

Wiper/Jumpers:

Elites - I use it sparingly but this is a mix of players who are either die hard raiders who expect all to be their equal (this I have experienced) and those who want it but don't work at it.

The prince/princess jumpers - This is the main body of players who are usually the one or two and wipe players. I haven't gotten a pulse on what their angle really is yet though, and I agree this is the group that will make HW new content interesting.

FIXES:

Current Fix - This is what I do usually and it helps with the problem with jumpers. I will DF and setup all language categlories for the DF to use. For me I usually a group that is a mix of JP, NA, EU and everyone is pretty commited to set it to the end.

Only snag is working the EX primal content where the lottery draw gets a bit rougher.

DF Ranking upgade - Sounds good, I would personally suggest them to make it a completely separate system and not try to overwrite the existing DF or we will get worse problems. PF is kinda good but you only get the luck of what your world has to offer for the hour time.

[Miitan]

What rattles my cage is when there's a PF like "Helping friend through T5" and you join to be nice and no one else knows the fight.

[Kaethra]

The duty finder is not broken and it does not need 'improvements'. Players simply need to use it for what it is intended for:

"I can't get a group for this on my server atm, and need to look beyond it."

That's it. If you want a competent group, make one. They do this on my server all the time. If you're learning the fight, join a learning group. If all else fails, use the DF but be happy it popped, but don't expect optimum results.

Besides what could they do to change it? Put a check box in saying, "I stink at this, but need help anyway" and put them all together? No one's going to click that. And even if you make it so first timers have to be grouped together, its not going to stop those who do it their first times in a premade and get ran through, which many do. And even then, you're just splitting up the playerbase, ensuring longer queues.

This is a player issue, solvable by the players. But both types of players (ones who can do the content, and ones who can't) need to meet in the middle and work something out. There are some things that just can't be solved by coding.

[Issac]

Here on Masamune, the Mana server group, we get mostly JP parties in DF. It's common practice, and expected, to vote disband after 2 fails. I'm neutral about it by now. I hear tell that the Japanese expect eachother to use PF to practice, but to come ready at your best in DF. Personally I practice in DF but I'm generally a quick learner anyway.

[Underlord]

90% of the players that jump ship are tanks imo... sure a few times its dps, but mainly tanks for me. I've seen players jump ship the minute it says there's a player new to the instance, or after one wipe. In fact the other day doing GEX, everything was going well. .. and at the end with garuda at 10% life everyone wiped.... in a blink of an eye half the group left. And that was just on the first pull.... lol

[Aoxaviar]

@ Kaethra - Very true and I agree with you completely. However, players also have come to expect SE to handle problems like this since there doesn't seem to be a way for the player base to find a middle ground.

I think that SE's best answer to the problem was the 30 penalty for jumping ship and that all they can really do.

Who knows, maybe SE has other tricks up their sleeve.

[Magusrex]

People have had some experiences that are so bad, that they would rather take a penalty than stay and experience that again. It is their life and their time to do with as they will. If you join DF and wipe sometimes people leave, nothing to complain about. It is the cost of using the DF.

[Alberel]

90% of the players that jump ship are tanks imo... sure a few times its dps, but mainly tanks for me. I've seen players jump ship the minute it says there's a player new to the instance, or after one wipe. In fact the other day doing GEX, everything was going well. .. and at the end with garuda at 10% life everyone wiped.... in a blink of an eye half the group left. And that was just on the first pull.... lol

Yes I've seen this too. I don't really understand it though. The first to leave still has to eat that 30 minute penalty so even a tank with an instant queue stands to gain nothing by quitting like that.

There are some tanks that develop a bit of a superiority complex as a result of their effective leadership role though. It's usually these ones (who are also often very vocal about their opinion of other players) that end up leaving first. I don't really get why but that's what I've observed.

[aerolol]

The way I see it is that some people have farmed whatever duty so much before echo existed for this duty that they strongly believe echo is not needed at all for the completion of the duty (and... they are usually right!!)

So if the DF party wiped 2-3 times, meaning they already had around 10% echo, and it was still a fail, some people lose hope.

Point is... echo is not needed, it helps a little but it's not needed.
Knowing and reacting to mechanics is needed. So if you have that BRD or DRG getting killed (or worse.. killing other players) by every mechanic, then there is probably very little hope for a win...
And ppl disband.

About the 30min penalty...
You can go craft, you can go level up your chocobo, you can queue for PvP content (if your lock is due to PvE content), you can afk and do something irl,...

That said I usually stick around a whole lot more than 2 wipes, but I feel VERY SAD when I see people in full lv130 gear wiping to Titan EX because wecan't kill the heart fast enough since the BRD and DRG were Landslided into the pit, and they think it's totally ok for them to be down there before heart phase.