New glamour dress on a male (art)

[DarkDedede]

You missed the point. It's not about how the players within the game see each other. We don't care, by and large.
It's how the people OUTSIDE the game see it.
The people reviewing resumes of the artists that designed the outfits.
The stockholders and bosses looking at the game.
The very, VERY vicious Japanese media looking for something to write a derisive article about on a slow news day.
Remember, there are games out there that get a bad rap for actions you CAN take in the game (such as your ability to mow down civilians in games like GTA and the Elder scrolls games, despite most of the actual story of the game not directing you to do such) that aren't even close to the focus.
So again, it has nothing to do with the players of the game, it has to do with those NOT playing the game that either have big wallets or loud mouths (or both)
Something REMOTELY controversial in Japan can torpedo your company's stock prices.
When Ayumi Hamasaki, a famous Japanese singer, had to announce that she was going deaf in one ear, the stock price for her company shot down like a rocket.

So do you have actual video game examples where cross dressing caused civil unrest among the Japanese stockholder population? How did the vicious Japanese media react to Eternal Bonding between two characters of the same gender? Also, if you, as a player, admit to not care "by and large," why are you going to such lengths to adamantly argue against this?

I suppose you are correct. Perhaps there is something I am missing.

[kyuven]

So do you have actual video game examples where cross dressing caused civil unrest among the Japanese stockholder population? How did the vicious Japanese media react to Eternal Bonding between two characters of the same gender? Also, if you, as a player, admit to not care "by and large," why are you going to such lengths to adamantly argue against this?

I suppose you are correct. Perhaps there is something I am missing.

I'm not arguing against this per se, I'm simply saying that it won't happen and why it won't happen. Again, I wouldn't mind either way, but that's not the issue I'm addressing.

"Do we want it?" Yes we do. "Can we have it?" No, we can't.
It's not "SHOULD SE do this?" it's "CAN SE do this?"

There aren't any direct examples because again, a lot of this is kept on the down-low. It's not crossdressing SPECIFICALLY that causes the issue, but ANY kind of activity or behavior that deviates from the social norm or conventional expectations. Moreover, it's not limited to one industry or another due to societal expectations. And again, a lot of media gets away with portraying crossdressing because they either center the plot around it (Wandering Son, Otomeboku) make the crossdresser a villain (WAY too many to name. I'll touch on this a bit.), turn the whole thing into a joke (Wall Market in FFVII, "Is this a Zombie?"'s plot), or some combination of the three, usually the second and third.

I found an article on the subject that might be worth reading:
http://en.rocketnews24.com/2014/06/0...relationships/
Oh...and as nasty as it sounds, you can bet the man mentioned in that article started receiving death threats not long after. If the teenaged pop singer could get them for going out on a date, imagine how bad it would be for someone who gets divorced over something that is normally associated with either comedy or villainy?
SE is not some fringe company that can be edgy and get away with it. They are a huge multi-national corporation with an image to maintain. And as I've mentioned, maintaining your image is HUGE in Japan. They even have specific words for it!
That image, as I mentioned before, allows for EFFEMINATE men but not for FEMININE men. I know the difference can be difficult, but it's there.
Basically, take a look at Amano's concept art for the various Final Fantasies. THAT is the limit. They're not going to be more feminine than what that portrays.

[lololink]

Hell just SEARCHING for these will make you realize something important: If you put any of the non-genderlocked outfits into a search engine, the top results will always be a female character wearing it, the posts from the developers announcing it, or something from TERA online (I have no idea why so many Elin show up when I search some of these outfits.). I really had to narrow my search criteria to find that dude in the wrap, whereas when i just entered the item name i got 2 pages of female characters.

Let's remove all races except female miqo'te then, others are too few to be bothered with. Same with raids. It's not because it's not used by everyone that you should not do it.
I agree having female outfits wear by male just doesn't fit, but you can have the same outfit slightly modified to fit a male body, just like the Yukata, both are almost the same but with slight adjustments, with slight adjustments you could totally give bunny outfits and bellydancers outfits to male.

The point is considering other gears made for men in the game, a dancer outfit close to the female one but for male wouldn't be "worse".
I was really happy when they decided to give us the long skirt and managed to put up the vanity you put earlier, I might glamour it again after seeing it back after some times.

[Terrini]

Hell just SEARCHING for these will make you realize something important: If you put any of the non-genderlocked outfits into a search engine, the top results will always be a female character wearing it, the posts from the developers announcing it, or something from TERA online (I have no idea why so many Elin show up when I search some of these outfits.). I really had to narrow my search criteria to find that dude in the wrap, whereas when i just entered the item name i got 2 pages of female characters.

Why do so many Elin show up? I'm not sure but the way people talk about it Elin get a gross favoritism as well (it sounds more extreme then our female exclusiveness here too) where Elin get all the glamor gear and even new classes all to them. Which I think is what Lololink was getting at with his post. The development team apparently decided Elin female was the most popular so that they just designed everything for Elin female. Although I admit this is hearsay only on my part.

You may be arguing for why it can't happen and not against it happening, but by doing so you are appearing antagonistic to the purpose of the thread which is not CAN it happen but we WANT it to happen and let them see what kind of support it has.

[kyuven]

Let's remove all races except female miqo'te then, others are too few to be bothered with. Same with raids. It's not because it's not used by everyone that you should not do it.

You're drawing hyperbole, in the excerpt you quoted I was simply expressing that there's just not a lot of call for the outfits to the point that even searching for them using the right name turns up more results for OTHER things than it does what you're actually searching for.
All this means is there's less DEMAND for skirts (and really, let's not kid ourselves. The skirt is the part people actually want here. The top has had more detractors than supporters purely on an aesthetic front, preferring a bare chest to what the OP designed, no one has mentioned the gloves at all, and I think two or three people mentioned the shoes, which aren't really all that special to begin with and i get the feeling even female characters will be using something else for them most of the time.) for male characters, so SE must leverage what it could cost them versus how they would benefit.

Why do so many Elin show up? I'm not sure but the way people talk about it Elin get a gross favoritism as well (it sounds more extreme then our female exclusiveness here too) where Elin get all the glamor gear and even new classes all to them. Which I think is what Lololink was getting at with his post. The development team apparently decided Elin female was the most popular so that they just designed everything for Elin female. Although I admit this is hearsay only on my part.

You may be arguing for why it can't happen and not against it happening, but by doing so you are appearing antagonistic to the purpose of the thread which is not CAN it happen but we WANT it to happen and let them see what kind of support it has.

It's true, in fact there are no Elin males. At one point in development, another race known as the Popori were going to be the males...but...well...

Also remember, even though I'm saying it won't happen, I'm not saying it SHOULDN'T happen. If you want it so bad, get the item on a male character even if you can't use it. Show them you want the outfit even if you can't have it. Simply posting in a thread saying "ooo this is neat!" won't necessarily draw their attention.
Which...yeah...this thread already got. When a few people crossed the line and got the mod to axe a bunch of posts.
They're READING this, but to them it's just another in a long line of posts of NA/EU players complaining about things they want/can't have. Go a step further.
Hell, if someone cosplayed the outfit at E3 as a male it might actually do something.

[Onikimaru]

snip

Are you a paid troll or just extremely ignorant because i really can't tell

[kyuven]

Are you a paid troll or just extremely ignorant because i really can't tell

So, are you willing to describe how I'm ignorant? Because I'm listening.
I'm definitely not paid, and I'm not trolling.

You want me to tell me why you're ignorant?. But you're so intelligent and wise...why would i do such a thing to a being such as yourself .

Make your point, or stop baiting please.

[Onikimaru]

So, are you willing to describe how I'm ignorant? Because I'm listening.
I'm definitely not paid, and I'm not trolling.

You want me to tell me why you're ignorant?. But you're so intelligent and wise...why would i do such a thing to a being such as yourself .

[DarkDedede]

It's not "SHOULD SE do this?" it's "CAN SE do this?"

I suppose we can both agree that all roads lead to politics. There are a lot of factors leading to any decision, when it comes to anything in this game. I doubt any one is an "end-all."

I also say we can both agree that neither of us envy the developers, as they are most likely of aware of factors that neither of us will ever be (or even suspect). So many proverbial mistresses to please.

We are consumers, so it's within out rights to make demands, unrealistic as they may seem. It's the developers' job to cater to those demands, when it's within their means. Until we get an official "No/Not/Never" statement, demands will continue to be made. Even then, there's always the chance that consumer demand will trump social bias.

[kyuven]

I suppose we can both agree that all roads lead to politics. There are a lot of factors leading to any decision, when it comes to anything in this game. I doubt any one is an "end-all."

I also say we can both agree that neither of us envy the developers, as they are most likely of aware of factors that neither of us will ever be (or even suspect). So many proverbial mistresses to please.

Very much so. As I've said over and over, it's OK to want things but as long as you understand that what you want may not be possible for such and such reasons.
As an example, I want a throne of skulls housing item. There's no reason for them to add it (it's not exactly heroic and there's not a lot of decor that goes with it), and it probably won't be added...but it's ok to dream. I can come up with justifications left and right for why they should add a throne of skulls, but in the end it's their decisions as to whether or not it's worth adding it. (I also want a right-click-report option but I think a lot of people want that)
Just try to understand that it's not personal. It's all business.