"Healer DPS is not taken into account" for raids

[Ghishlain]

Slycer from BG translated a Game Watch interview with Yoshi-P. His translation can be found here.

Of note, there was a discussion about WHM DPS which lead to a tangent about raid design and the DPS check, leading to this quote:

Yoshida: Yes. Since all DPS jobs will be increasing up through level 60, it makes sense to have the white mage's DPS extend by a proportional amount as well. For development, such as with Bahamut's Coils, the development team assumes what the item level should be for general equipment on players when they clear a raid. They sum up the basic DPS for four DPS and tanks at that assumed item level and cut that by about 10-15% for the minimum clear DPS. Healer DPS is not taken into account when this is set.

Certainly for people who are at world's first level, their goal is to clear it at as low an item level as possible, lower than the one assumed during development. So if you look at the fight and figure out that if it's not numerically possible to clear with four DPS and tanks, you'll need to make up the gap with DPS from healers. Then when those publish clear videos and other people see the healers DPSing, they might think that healers need to be DPSing even though its a situation that only arose because their clear would have otherwise been impossible. While we could take this into account, and assume a different item level in the next update which would then make it impossible to clear even with the healer DPS, we'd eliminate this type of play for highly skilled players who use communication, items, and a high level of understanding to come up with those last second clears. That would be a tough decision to make, so I still think it should be up to each party's own plans.

This is also one of the reasons we decided to implement both a normal and savage version of Alexander. Once again, healer DPS was not included in the development team's calculation as it was for other jobs, so you should just think of healer DPS as a last way to get your overall party's DPS up to where it needs to be.

The reason I brought this up was partially because there's been a discussion in a few thread in the past where posters indicate if the developers may or may not have accounted for healer DPS when they built their raids and/or dungeons.

(I also just want to have this quote handy in my history =D)

To quote, the DPS check is calculated by:

They sum up the basic DPS for four DPS and tanks at that assumed item level and cut that by about 10-15% for the minimum clear DPS. Healer DPS is not taken into account when this is set.

What this means to me:

No, as a healer you are not required to DPS to beat content.

However,

Yes, you are inefficient if you aren't DPSing when opportunities present themselves to allow for DPS because the dev team gave you the tools to increase your DPS presence.

And

Yes, you should be attempting to play your role to the best of your capabilities (whether it be Tank, DPS, Heals).

[LycorisSelunis]

This is super nice dev insight to have!

[Cynfael]

This is more or less what I'd always assumed (that they do consider that healers can and often will DPS, but that it isn't a criterion for tuning clear minimums).

Nice to know, but I don't think this will make a difference in anyone's play style. Players who see healer DPS as a crutch for groups with poor DPS will continue to act as if attacking mobs were beneath them/not in their job description, while better-rounded/more active players will keep doing what they're doing. And the truly bad players will keep on killing everyone regardless of how they play, but that too is status quo.

[SovereignAegis]

I have always contributed to DPS as a scholar, I see absolutely no reason to not. I never really run out of mana in the first place and applying a few DoTs and ignoring them after that is nice.

Will I dps during a crutch period? Oh hell no.

But if I know it's safe to then I will, even in an emergency popping out of cleric stance and healing takes half a second.

[Sapphic]

I have always contributed to DPS as a scholar, I see absolutely no reason to not. I never really run out of mana in the first place and applying a few DoTs and ignoring them after that is nice.

Will I dps during a crutch period? Oh hell no.

But if I know it's safe to then I will, even in an emergency popping out of cleric stance and healing takes half a second.

Not to mention lustrate and fairy heals are unafected by cleric stance ^^

[Shurrikhan]

I doubt that any world first group, for instance, is using healer DPS as a crutch "for poor DPS". It's to clear with that much less gear.

Not to mention lustrate and fairy heals are unafected by cleric stance ^^

Lustrate is affected. It's no longer a HP percentage, which now means WAR's Defiance no longer buffs it, either. Whereas ALL healing abilities (Benediction and Lustrate) used to be %HP, now the majority are unaffected by Defiance.

[Thekk]

Lustrate is affected. It's no longer a HP percentage, which now means WAR's Defiance no longer buffs it, either. Whereas ALL healing abilities (Benediction and Lustrate) used to be %HP, now the majority are unaffected by Defiance.

It isn't true anymore, but it was at the time it was posted (look at the date), so can't really call someone about it other than the guy who revived this thread.

[melflomil]

When did this interview come out? I swear read somewhere that they included the DPS of healers now for the new raids?

[Tranquil]

When did this interview come out? I swear read somewhere that they included the DPS of healers now for the new raids?

A bit over two weeks ago.

[FoxyAreku]

I've always been of the opinion of "Who cares if it's taken into account, there's literally no reason to /not/ add extra DPS if you can do it without anyone dying".