ishgard

[Belhi]

Its worth pointing out that Ishgard was actually attacked. They mention the attack later on. I think his comment suggested that it indicated that someone was feeding the Dravanians information for them to know to attack when he wasn't there, ie. Dravanian spies in Ishgard.

[Viridiana]

Its worth pointing out that Ishgard was actually attacked. They mention the attack later on. I think his comment suggested that it indicated that someone was feeding the Dravanians information for them to know to attack when he wasn't there, ie. Dravanian spies in Ishgard.

That, and the "How the **** do the Ul'dahn Monetarists know about this before we do when it's our job to know?" Something very fishy about that attack, in the sense of "Just how corrupt can Ul'dah be before we decide it's best to just raze the city?"

[Belhi]

That's a case of baby and the bath water. Same could probably be said for Ishgard. Ul'dah has corruption in its rulers but the majority of Ul'dah is alright. For all their distain for refugees, they are the city state that has taken the vast bulk of them in. Ul'dah's Immortal Flames protect the refugees from threats like the Amaljaa in areas like Little Ala Mhigo.

Plus to you really want to be the one to trash Godbert's wife's home?

[AzraelX]

ummm Aymeric better not be traitor that would be horrible plot twist.. i think Irvine has had enough betrayal in his life at this pot and don't want to be even more jaded. I actually like Aymeric and appears to be very grateful to the WoL and wants to extend his influence and graces for Ishgards and our benefits. Aymeric was like WTf when he was being called by to Ishgard....i almost thought he wasn't going to leave.

I don't trust the Holy See.....

[Viridiana]

That's a case of baby and the bath water. Same could probably be said for Ishgard. Ul'dah has corruption in its rulers but the majority of Ul'dah is alright. For all their distain for refugees, they are the city state that has taken the vast bulk of them in. Ul'dah's Immortal Flames protect the refugees from threats like the Amaljaa in areas like Little Ala Mhigo.

Would that the corruption were limited to the rulers. Sure, they're the source of it, but their foot soldiers are just as corrupt and not rulers. Ungust was willing to sell people to the Amalj'aa for profit, and he had a man in the Brass Blades in on it. Neither of them are rulers. None of the Crystal Braves who were traitors were rulers that I'm aware of. Heck, Ilberd was the primary traitor and he was a mere refugee. I doubt Nanamo's handmaiden was a ruler. The Brass Blades who were backing Lolorito aren't rulers.

Ul'dah has so many people jockeying for the top spot without regard to even basic morality that I don't understand why anyone continues to support them, unless it's to keep the corruption confined to one place so everyone knows where the dagger will come from. . .

[Cilia]

In regards to the Dravanian assault, the timing is too perfect to be coincidental. Given the glaringly obvious but unconfirmed possibility the Monetarists are in league with the Ascians (or, at the very least have Ascian contact), and the likely possibility that the Ascians are manipulating Dravania though their mouthpiece (Ysayle)... as well as that Aymeric would instantly call shenanigans if he were still there... I'm pretty sure everything in "The Parting Glass" was carefully engineered and executed.

I don't think Aymeric or Haurchefant will betray us; on the contrary, I'd wager we're going to end up deposing the Ishgard Pope (Archbishop Thordan VII... or VIII... something like that).

[Frederick22]

I would like to point something else, Aymeric wasnt the super helpfull guy, al least not at the begining and to be honest he still isnt that kind of guy, if everyone here saw specialy the 2.4 story, you would understand my point.

[Cilia]

While Aymeric is more pragmatic than altruistic, I'd like to think the only reason he's like that is because as Knight-Commander he has to follow the Holy See's orders. I always got the feeling he was willing to help us out, but was limited in his actions by his orders and a shortage of manpower due to the Dragonsong War.

While he always plays a game of quid pro quo with us, I don't think it's fair to hold that against him.

[Samcaesar]

Snip

See, that's the thing, it's almost too perfect. Everyone actually likes Aymeric. He, and the rest of the house of Fortemps much too open to outsides, if anything it almost sounds like to me the Ascians are playing a game to get the Warriors of Light in a city where they have their hands dug into the highest of powers. Unlike in Ul'dah, in which the Monetarists hardly control those in lower positions and the lower class, in Ishgard the Pope has an incredibly devout following.

If you don't trust the Holy See, why should you trust devout members of them? Aymeric is a man of faith still.

Snip

See, my only issue with that is I don't think Ysayle is so easily manipulated by the Ascians, she's so far the only one in the story to have the Echo and not be a Scion, with also direct knowledge of Hydaelyn as well saying something along the lines of "Don't squander Mother's gift" to the PC. Honestly, I think she's quite aware of the Ascians and their purpose, especially after the whole Shiva incident, and probably distances herself when she can from them. Why would Aymeric call shenanigans on the events? Raubahn did and we know what happened to him (Where how plausible it is or not :P). Aymeric really doesn't have a reason to shove himself into the midst of an Ul'dah/Eorzea conflict, even the leaders of the other GC (Or well their men) didn't want that.

After we depose the Pope (If we do), which both Aymeric and Haurchefant like being men of faith and all, why wouldn't they betray us? Remember, Haurchefant didn't disobey the church during that Coerthas incident, he just thought that the one guy was framed, if he was an actual Dravanian cohort he'd want him at the bottom of the ravine like anyone else. They still hate dragons and Dravanians.

[Frederick22]

While Aymeric is more pragmatic than altruistic, I'd like to think the only reason he's like that is because as Knight-Commander he has to follow the Holy See's orders. I always got the feeling he was willing to help us out, but was limited in his actions by his orders and a shortage of manpower due to the Dragonsong War.

While he always plays a game of quid pro quo with us, I don't think it's fair to hold that against him.

You are totally right cililia, I agree with you. I just wanted to make clear that he didnt looked like a super helpfull guy and beacuase of that we shouldnt trust him, not again this paranoia trust thing lol. In fact the way he is with us, specialy beacuse he is Ishgardian, makes me beliebe we can fully trust on him.