DPS is too slow guys! (OMG!!!)

[MirielleLavandre]

"DPS is too low... xxxx ur dps is (trow parser DPS), everyone go out a kick him"

To be fair, I think people who parse would usually not say something like this in a group where they are using pick-up players, as that would be grounds for a 3 day ban or a talking to by a GM should the low dps person report using something like that as evidence. I think most would talk among themselves or in voice chat and just kick the low performing dps without even saying why -- though I have hardly ever seen/heard of this happening among my friends who raid.

[valoiz2]

Totally agree.. so now all the weight of the fight is on space classes. No one blames when a healer wipe the party "sorry I get lag" or "sorry I moved and heal get interrupted" ... Also tanks "oops I wasted provoke" or "sorry I couldn't get that add" ... "sorry I couldn't provoke in time the boss" all thidea answers and more are just fine.
Now.....
If the add didn't die fast.... *party gets enrage* and:."dps is too low!" *using parse* *tell everyone dps * ... *disband party* Lol
Dafuk? Hahahaha

[Staris]

Totally agree.. so now all the weight of the fight is on space classes. No one blames when a healer wipe the party "sorry I get lag" or "sorry I moved and heal get interrupted" ... Also tanks "oops I wasted provoke" or "sorry I couldn't get that add" ... "sorry I couldn't provoke in time the boss" all thidea answers and more are just fine.
Now.....
If the add didn't die fast.... *party gets enrage* and:."dps is too low!" *using parse* *tell everyone dps * ... *disband party* Lol
Dafuk? Hahahaha

Not true, bad tanks are vote kicked all the time, as are bad healers.
The problem is if your lazy or bad your 95% of the time going to go as a DPS because its the lazy role.

[Twilite]

I do NOT agree with that at all. DPS ain't no lazy role.

[LTEvil]

I do NOT agree with that at all. DPS ain't no lazy role.

Dps to meet non progressive checks is. Gear makes the mild checks moot. I personally believe raid mt is the easiest role in a raid though. Hence why call out etc should fall upon them.

Now hard working dps? Progression groups where healer dps is not required.

[Twilite]

Dps to meet non progressive checks is. Gear makes the mild checks moot. I personally believe raid mt is the easiest role in a raid though. Hence why call out etc should fall upon them.

Now hard working dps? Progression groups where healer dps is not required.

Oh nice. Thanks for labeling every single DPS lazy then, with that definition(not much progression left in this game. Very clever there Lina.) Being considerate is a lost art in today worlds so I guess you never stopped to consider that maybe there's players out there that work hard as DPS regardless of the "mode" they are playing in.

So we're gonna start this Tank/healer vs DPS, bullshit now?

[Krylo]

snip

The point is that, outside of progression raiding, DPS CAN be lazy and still pass DPS checks. If a healer isn't doing their job people die. This is obvious. A healer must heal (though they can be lazy and not DPS) or people will notice. If a Tank isn't doing their job monsters run all over the place. This is obvious. A tank must hold aggro (though, again, can be lazy and not stance dance/maximize DPS) or people will know. A DPS, on the other hand, can get away with standing behind a boss and hitting 1 over and over again and it's unlikely anyone will notice unless they're watching that DPS specifically or using a third party program. A DPS does not need to DPS (much) because no one will know, so long as the fight is passed. All of this is exacerbated by the fact that DPS outnumber tanks and healers by either 2-1 or more, so there's more DPS to spread the blame around to if things are dying slow: Are all the DPS just kinda mediocre, or is one face rolling while the others are doing good enough to make up for it? Hard to tell without taking time out from your own job to watch them all AND being knowledgeable enough in their jobs to see what they're doing wrong/right or getting a parser (which you can't bring up, anyway).

What this means is that, while there are a good amount of DPS who do put in the work even when they're doing trash dungeons, there's also plenty that queue into CT raids and just do the minimal amount to not be obvious about their laziness. There's also plenty that just don't know the right rotation for their class (maybe they were told the wrong rotation, maybe they just aren't great at video games and never looked anything up, why is irrelevant) and are pulling really terrible numbers and thinking they're doing okay because how bad they are is non-obvious.

[Gardes]

If a Tank isn't doing their job monsters run all over the place. This is obvious. A tank must hold aggro (though, again, can be lazy and not stance dance/maximize DPS) or people will know. A DPS, on the other hand, can get away with standing behind a boss and hitting 1 over and over again and it's unlikely anyone will notice unless they're watching that DPS specifically or using a third party program. A DPS does not need to DPS (much) because no one will know, so long as the fight is passed.

You know, a DPS can actually sabotage the tank's performance in dungeons. I tank the majority of my roulette dungeons and after a bunch of runs I start coming up with patterns around my defensive skills and pulls based on a party's dps output. Mostly based on my vengeance timing, whether I have it on next pull, whether I should compensate with inner beast, whether I can make do with just ToB and conval or just flat out steel cyclone etc. You know, mostly trying to keep a decent sized pull while not being randomly tough and squishy between pulls so that healer doesnt have to second guess when they can go dpsing if they chose to.

Anyway, back to the party's dps output thing, I check their gear and estimate their potential and then deduct it by a bit and then decide to pull 2-3 packs or just 1 pack. Some dps have indeed been able to floor me with how bad they are that the mitigations that I usually allocate to that pull are not enough anymore and I'm becoming dangerously squishy for too long if I don't burn extra mitigation on that first pull alone. But then the party would be falsely thinking that they're at a higher level than what they're actually at and expect me to pull at least the same amount of mobs next, when I already burned my important cds to prevent a wipe caused by super low damage output.

[SirDiscoFrog]

What this means is that, while there are a good amount of DPS who do put in the work even when they're doing trash dungeons, there's also plenty that queue into CT raids and just do the minimal amount to not be obvious about their laziness.

Everyone yells at the tanks when Platinals or Iron Giants are running wild attacking heals, but no one says a word to the Goon in the corner behind a Tower who went AFK lol

I dont think its so much as a double standards it is just easier to attack tanks and healers who are under preforming or even to try to point blame at them for things out of their control. In any case if there are any problem with a run, whether it be tanks losing hate or dps checks not being made, it should be brought up in a polite manner. Babying players helps no one and neither does raging/insulting players. In all cases the problem should be sought out and suggestions should be made as to how to improve. It could be too many deaths/weakness, it could be folk being under-geared, a player could have a faulty rotation, or it could be people being lazy, which unfortunately is easier to do as a dps.

[KisaiTenshi]

The point is that, outside of progression raiding, DPS CAN be lazy and still pass DPS checks.

The thing that is super-irritating as a healer, is that I know who isn't doing their part because I'm watching the hp/mp/cast/buff/debuffs. The DPS that aren't pulling their weight are the ones that aren't using any rotations, or are just straight up standing still.

And you know what, these bums still get carried through raids because they refuse to roll on the loot. As soon as they get the piece the want, they exit the raid.