RIP Ninja

[RiceisNice]

So you're basically saying if ninja wanted to be efficent on dps, they're forced to use their new actions with the positional?
Is that not the same concept as what bard is getting? that I mean end game is probably going to be adjusted to have them required to manage wanderer's to maximize bard's dps to be relatively the same as what we're seeing now. Bards have entire actions that require Minuet to be used...I hardly consider that to be as little as an "option".

And some people played bard because of the freedom of movement when it came to dps. If they wanted to maximize it in 3.0, managing wanderer's is going to be mandatory which forces them to play stationary when possible, as well as seeing when is it a good time to use wanderers because of the cast time on it.

[silentwindfr]

is clearly not the same, if you had said me that bard will be in the same position than a healer that toggle on and off cleric stance, i will have say yes. but here is not close of use positional.
one question, why move when is not needed? because you will retain your freedom to move and attack when is needed. it's simply offering you an option to increase your dps. that not the case for the ninja. wanderer minuet is a boost of dps, not the positional of the ninja.

wanderer minuet offer you more option! up to you to use it or not. but a ninja that want to play normally, will be forced to use the positional. or them dps, will drop from what they can do now. when a bard not using wanderer minuet will retain them actual dps.

[RiceisNice]

...

If a bard using wanderer's minuet is optional (I don't have to use it), then I can very much say the same for ninja's new skills in your case. Because bard has at least two skills that requires wanderer's minuet to be used. It's a safe assumption to say that bards would need to manage this to pull respectable dps in content to keep up with other classes who also get new skills.

If I'm not/don't want to use Wanderer's Minuet, I might as well play bard as it; without 3.0 Skills.
If you as a ninja do not want to use the new skills that require positional, then you can play ninja as it isl without 3.0 skills.

[Allyrion]

Yea, the comparison is completely valid. (I've been making it too)
Similarly, some people are upset with BRD will have to stay still for maximum efficiency while people are upset NIN will have to move into position for maximum efficiency.

We don't know if we'll be doing the same damage as before.
It was never clarified if positional bonuses will be added damage or taken from our current potencies.
There's no reason to make the assumption one way or the other.

Of course the BRD will be balanced around using WM and NIN will be balanced around positionals.
It's not like BRD gets WM and they have some option to surpass everyone while we're tied to being balance.
That reasoning has a clear double standard.

[silentwindfr]

We don't know if we'll be doing the same damage as before.
It was never clarified if positional bonuses will be added damage or taken from our current potencies.
There's no reason to make the assumption one way or the other.

Wanderer minuet is a skill added after level 50, it will be a boost of dps, it's them answer to the bard asking for more damage.
it was really clear from what did said yoshida that the skill of the ninja will be changed for included the positional, is not a change past 50, it will be a change of the skill of when you get it. meaning the dps will still be the same than what we can do now without it.

why that? simple, because some people will not buy the expansion, and if the boost from the positional is an increase of the actual dps... it will make the jobs unbalanced for the player without the expansion.

you can argue that WM will change the way to play the bard and i will say, yes, but not as much as positional will affect the ninja. my point saying that wanderer minuet is an option for increase your damage when not moving is more than valid, it's the goal of this skill. allows player to increase them damage when they don't need to move! it offer you the possibility to increase your damage when you don't need to move. allowing the bard that want to be at the same level than some blm, smn to reach this goal.

positional will not offer more option for increase our damage, is a restriction and it was presented as that. when wanderer minuet was presented as an option for increase your damage. it quite different in the approach.

38 pages of complaints on taking 2 steps to the left/right.

why not change the core mechanic of your jobs, let's remove the stance or something like this... because that what they do.

ps: oh another point that quite amusing, can they explain me, why we do have a skill recquiring to be infront of the enemy for deal massive damage, when they have used as explanation about the add of the positional, the fact that only tank must fight head on?

[Elazu]

why not change the core mechanic of your jobs, let's remove the stance or something like this... because that what they do.

Having no positionals is the ninja's core mechanic?

Lmao

[Allyrion]

why that? simple, because some people will not buy the expansion, and if the boost from the positional is an increase of the actual dps... it will make the jobs unbalanced for the player without the expansion.

Seems like a weak reason.
Pre max level content is never balanced, 50 is now leveling content.
Do you really think they're not going to change the balance of the current classes in addition to the new abilities.
All Jobs will now be balanced by the full kit. They're not going to keep all the potencies the same just to keep old content balanced.
It's really unlikely all classes won't have some potency changes to their current abilities simply to adjust for the new abilities and to balance around what the other classes get.

If positionals are bonus potencies, WM will be bonus damage for standing still.
We'll be balanced around that, so the numbers right now are really irrelevant because they can always be adjusted and certainly will be for 3.0.
No one is getting free damage, it will all be taken into consideration they look at balance.

If they're successful at simulating the Jobs in a live battle is another matter, but retaining old numbers and pre-50 kits just for people who won't buy the expansion?
Yea, that would be a design flaw and I'll be really surprised if SE care at all about 50 balance after the level cap is raised.

I'm pretty sure the positional is applied to the Huton refresh move which will be added onto the end of the gust slash combo. If this is it then it's hardly game breaking. The job could use a bit more complexity to be honest. I haven't seen any info about them retroactively adding positionals to previous moves so unless someone can source such a thing I'd say it's rumor and a baseless concern at best.

Nah, not baseless. They implied it's added to old moves and they said several.

Furthermore, we have added positioning to several weapon skills. Current ninja doesn’t have much positioning and was able to attack from any direction freely, so we included positioning for some.

Source

[Kuroyasha]

38 pages of complaints on taking 2 steps to the left/right.

[Elazu]

38 pages of complaints on taking 2 steps to the left/right.

Just another day on the Lodestone.

[Akashiya]

38 pages of complaints on taking 2 steps to the left/right.

Good to know you actually looked through the 38 pages and didn't just assume everyone was complaining.(obviously you didn't)

Ahem let me quote you on this.

Honestly, if everything is going to be similar then they might as well just have one melee class. Id rather they just keep to what they express their goal is with each class.