Patch Notes are up!

[Wildsprite]

OH...

MY...

GOD.

They might as well have just handed everybody Steps at this point. They pretty much nerfed everything!

It's clear that the number of players who were clearing content was completely unacceptable to Square-Enix, so crap on all of us (yes, even me who went 1/30 or something) who actually cleared it unnerfed.

This isn't a nerf -- this is a wipeout!

lemme guess, you're one of those FFXI nuts that wanted Absolute Virtue in his original nearly unbeatable stage right? you remember that right? the devs swear to this day he was beatable but they never revealed how and people tried for days on end to find a way to beat him making themselves sick. you know how he was beat before they nerfed him? someone found a glitch that's how.

don't sell your own wins short because they nerf something. SoF is main scenario afterall, if too many people keep quitting it you might have some people leave. now you might not think this is a bad thing but remember this. SE needs to make money to keep giving us content. and if enough people leave SE starts to lose money. this would be bad.

[Nalien]

And why is that wrong? Independent play was one of the best inventions for the casual player.

It's a recipe for disaster, that's whats wrong.

People want to log on, not say a word to anyone, or even listen to anyone else, and still get some gratification? Fine. Let them have that independent play solo. Why on earth would you shove them together with other players if they want to be independent? It is really no surprise that this game has such a tense schism between casual and hardcore. Give them solo content if that's what they want, this whole "I should be carried through every encounter" mentality is just harmful to the overall community.

I wouldn't even say communicating with your party is time consuming. What's time consuming is the people who ignore communication. They're the ones who are ignoring advice and causing wipes. They're the ones keeping themselves, and others, from clearing content. There isn't a single instance in this game that cannot be easily communicated and practiced in the Duty Finder, but the instant gratification mentality just results in people leaving the moment one thing goes wrong and instead looking for a carry in the next Duty Finder group, wasting the entire groups time and just resulting in so much of the hostility we've come to expect from the Duty Finder.

[Jamein]

Maybe not for the first couple days, when everyone was learning it (and only one person was saying it was hard), but:

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...Steps-of-Faith Here's the thread where SE finally decided to 'do something'.

What is it complaining about?

Cause and effect.

People leaving were not the initial cause, the cause was that some people simply couldn't do the content because it required some level of thought, i.e raised difficulty level because it wasn't simply tank and spank.
People being unable to deal with basics in the game caused the trial to be a nightmare to go into, which had the result of people leaving the duty (and I agree, this is an absolute douche thing to do)
So everyone complaining about SoF, look into the reasoning behind why they say people abandon, some people on the next page of that thread saying it's because people don't know what to do, or if you miss a dragon killer it's a wipe, someone even says it is too 'unforgiving' which I just find...

I'm not saying you are wrong, I'm just saying the abandoning problem stems more from people thinking the fight itself is too hard for PUGS and don't want to waste their time on it. So asking to fix that is pretty much asking for a nerf and you know it. There's already a penalty for leaving DF.

And, no, the problem isn't REALLY abandons. It's that abandoning, is, hands down, the SMART thing to do.

Just saw you edit your post, and this is what it comes down too yes, and that's because when people are presented with a fight that isn't an easy tank and spank, they run a mile.

[Krylo]

People being unable to deal with basics in the game caused the trial to be a nightmare to go into, which had the result of people leaving the duty

Nope.

Queuing for something (trial roulette) they thought would take 2 minutes, and then having to spend 3 minutes explaining, 9 minutes failing, 9 minutes failing again, and then 9 minutes succeeding did that. Even the absolute best case scenario is using 1/3rd of your lock out time for leaving for no rewards except 15 soldiery and 7 poetics. A whole 3/2 more than Garuda HM, but with no chance at weapon (glamour or GC seals) or TT card, while taking 5 times as long. You could do literally anything else in that time and get better rewards. And that's best case. Average for ANY trial with a good portion of first timers is 2-3 wipes. That's over 30 minutes, longer than your lockout, to get. . . basically nothing.

It's how long the wipes took. Not that they happened. Chrysalis wiped constantly when it was new, too. On day 1 it took me about 3 or 4 DF groups to find one that could do it, running out the clock on the trial at least twice. No one seriously complained about it. It's still not nerfed.

Edit: I edit posts a lot within the first 10-30 seconds because of the 1000 character limit. Which is annoying/stupid.

[Kiroh]

lemme guess, you're one of those FFXI nuts that wanted Absolute Virtue in his original nearly unbeatable stage right?

You're seriously comparing Vishap to Absolute Virtue in ANY sense much less pre-nerf?

[Krylo]

Welp, game's back up, time to stop 'playing forums'.

[Jamein]

Queuing for something (trial roulette) they thought would take 2 minutes, and then having to spend 3 minutes explaining, 9 minutes failing, 9 minutes failing again, and then 9 minutes succeeding did that. Even the absolute best case scenario is using 1/3rd of your lock out time for leaving for no rewards except 15 soldiery and 7 poetics. A whole 3/2 more than Garuda HM, but with no chance at weapon (glamour or GC seals) or TT card, while taking 5 times as long. You could do literally anything else in that time and get better rewards. And that's best case. Average for ANY trial with a good portion of first timers is 2-3 wipes. That's over 30 minutes, longer than your lockout, to get. . . basically nothing.

I can see your point, but that would cause people to NOT sign up in my opinion, because if you were to sign up, get SoF and leave without even trying you then run the risk of getting SoF again on your next run, then you've just wasted an hour doing absolutely nothing at all because you have the penalty.

Look, I am not disagreeing with you on how people are abandoning it causing more problems. I'm just saying that the whole reason that trial is causing problems, is because the average skill level of the playerbase is pretty damn low and they find something like that too much to deal with in a PUG. So in essence, asking for ANY change to that fight, is asking for a nerf (aside from the idea that you could reset the fight rather than waiting 9 minutes for it to finish, that idea I actually absolutely agree with).

[Spiritreaver1217]

You're seriously comparing Vishap to Absolute Virtue in ANY sense much less pre-nerf?

Not speaking for that poster, but personally i got that the mindset for "i wantz teh uber fightin' challenge!!1!!" that ppl against any AV change had was more what was being referenced in that post.

And truthfully i can see the comparison.

[SarcasmMisser]

Vishap's maximum HP has been reduced.
The maximum HP of all enemies that spawn has been reduced.
Damage dealt by certain enemies has been reduced.
Damage dealt by Vishap's underfoot attack has been reduced.
Damage dealt by Bertha cannons upon exploding has been reduced.

[Merryl]

What even drops from steps that's so wanted??