[Suggestion] SAMURAI

[Alacran]

The Samurai of war time would have attacked from behind, the Samurai of propaganda may have said they wouldn't. Though I suppose people like the one of propaganda otherwise they'd ask for a spear or a bow (which Samurai excelled at) vs a sword which was their secondary (practiced more later, but not because of being suddenly superior).

Thats probably another part of why I want to see Samurai DD, just to reduce the amount of serious exaggeration - indestructible super perfect sword soldier (Katana was completely capable of cutting though ). Poor western knights don't get that amount of love, in fact they get anti love... lol (at least it seems to me a lot of people assume they were a bunch of dumb brutes and dumb blacksmith, both far from the truth).

Its true that it is not really important to dispel anymore, not like we're facing a cult of Samurai trying to take over the world - but I've never been a big fan of any sort of self-gain exaggeration especially one that tends to be nationalistic. I've always wondered if that is why SE frequently gives Samurai coin toss as an ability, to while keep some elements of fun romanticized Samurai but also to just say "hehe, most damaging attack depends on how much money you have" a make fun of the later period of an average Samurai.

I actually agree with the fact over exaggeration of anything Japanese is plain silly. Anyone in a true fight would take every chance (fair or unfair) to survive. That being said the subject here is to include it in to a fantasy game, the romanticized warrior poet that served faithfully and deadly efficiently. The idea of Samurai's attacking the back side of an enemy as a dps came from the idea of a subclass of THF in FFXI, some thing even the developers did not intend, but was continued by min maxers who also gave us gear swapping...

[Shougun]

I actually agree with the fact over exaggeration of anything Japanese is plain silly. Anyone in a true fight would take every chance (fair or unfair) to survive. That being said the subject here is to include it in to a fantasy game, the romanticized warrior poet that served faithfully and deadly efficiently. The idea of Samurai's attacking the back side of an enemy as a dps came from the idea of a subclass of THF in FFXI, some thing even the developers did not intend, but was continued by min maxers who also gave us gear swapping...

oo.. Gear swapping.. *cries*.. lol

In your view of honor does it require them to take the hits for the party? I imagine there might be a few ways to coax a DD closer to the front more often, perhaps with a way to effectively avoid cleaving attacks/damage bonus (cleave attacks being a major concern to standing in front).

This game is definitely not real, thank goodness - not a fan of primals mind controlling me... although Garu-- nope! So its "get over"-able lol, but I do like references and nods to reality (as my own 'personal' preference). So having the entire romanticized package makes my eyebrow twitch (and the screams of fanatical "this is the truth! Best weapon to ever exist, ever! Desu!" type of fans - double twitch lol), specially in reference to the game's own reality where we already have competent craftsmen and parrying mechanics. Which sounds a bit funny "the game's own reality" but I'd at least, at least, wish for a good explanation on why the sword could take so much damage and a way to answer why not everyone turns into parrying gods (because Samurai (in games) aren't known for big obvious magics like flare, it'd have to be something spiritual - which is fine that sort of fits thematically to the later Samurai anyways, I think).

Random example of building some sort of aether idea into mechanics might be that each use of weapon infuses the sword's capabilities, their toolset sort of becomes a game of tempo and controlling your 'life-line' through a battery aka the soul and life of your sword. You could go off tempo for extra damage or aggro, perhaps even bringing it into a cursed thirsty state- another famous thing to do with Katanas, also giving you damage mode like the other tanks get. Technically you could use the dance and tempo for DD as well but at least if tank it would be sort of an explanation along the lines of "the weapon is a reflection of your own will, its durability is yours". Just a single buff monitoring battery system is probably too easy and boring so might need to add another level there like different types of tempo abilities (initiators, filler, finisher, tempo shifting, perhaps a monk-esque system) - so in the end result it is sort of a dance and you think of it like one. Would allow balance between the slow reserved play vs the frantic explosion of steel, both a stereotype for cinema Katana (its not exclusive to that weapon, but you see it a lot in films that use it with a mix of solemn slow start interspersed with blindingly fast multi-strikes).

[Riastrad]

I would personally enjoy Samurai as a tank. Not for me as I already found my tank class (Warrior). Getting those insta ques is an awesome feeling. Even more so when you get that bonus Gil. The only people that wouldn't want Samurai as a tank are those who wouldn't want to step up. Complain about Dps que times all you want, you only have human nature to blame. So... Step up.

[EdwinLi]

I would personally enjoy Samurai as a tank. Not for me as I already found my tank class (Warrior). Getting those insta ques is an awesome feeling. Even more so when you get that bonus Gil. The only people that wouldn't want Samurai as a tank are those who wouldn't want to step up. Complain about Dps que times all you want, you only have human nature to blame. So... Step up.

There are other reasons than just "Step Up"

I personally see SAM as a possible canidate for being a DPS and they would also fit into becoming the 2nd Job that uses Mail Armor.

Then there is also the requirements people will need to be a Tank Player with having the top notch gears to keep up with the constant growing DPS rate a good amount of community develops through their tome and/or coil gears, know how to tank more than 4 mobs, Tolerance towards people who want you to do what they want, discrimination due to how other Tanks act, constant lectures about how they would be better if they were the tank, and etc.

Beyond that playing tank roles just rewards players with faster queues and more gil from roulette.

(I still have a bunch of other things to add the list of things Tanks must be prepared for but it is a long list of past and current experience so I'm just mentioning the basic need to know.)

[Erudain]

Also If you think releasing XXX class/job as a tank will incentive ppl to become tanks, you're pretty naive.
People who like to tank will tank, people who don't won't because of all the stress involved (brace for the incoming lolDKNs tanks)...most you'll get is ppl who like the class doing the job quest for the story, max... maybe you'll have a small % that discover they actually like or are good naturally tanking, but those'll be the least.

If they don't like to tank, no ammount of DKN, SAM, Lightning-jumping-around, Cloud-using-his-bike, will make them tank.

[OMEGA_HACK]

Also If you think releasing XXX class/job as a tank will incentive ppl to become tanks, you're pretty naive.
People who like to tank will tank, people who don't won't because of all the stress involved (brace for the incoming lolDKNs tanks)...most you'll get is ppl who like the class doing the job quest for the story, max... maybe you'll have a small % that discover they actually like or are good naturally tanking, but those'll be the least.

If they don't like to tank, no ammount of DKN, SAM, Lightning-jumping-around, Cloud-using-his-bike, will make them tank.

Since something like this hasn't really happened...or wait it kinda has but to the reverse effects. Archer DPS; the strongest DPS (in 1.0) when jobs were announced and they said archer would become bard people immediately though FFXI Bard and that it would become a weak support class saying they would jump ship if that were the case. It did go from the top DPS to the lowest DPS and is still one of the most played jobs in the game, meaning that all those people who cried foul never actually followed through with their cries. (average WoD has like 6-7 BRDs in them), most DF groups get at least 1 BRD DPS, etc etc.

In fact lots of players that I know who were DRK (this is the correct abbreviation btw, not DKN) mains in FFXI (because you know us lol jobs--DRG and DRK--had to stick together between all that stigma) are still going to play DRK as a tank, not because of the role but because they wanted DRK and now they can get it. I have a feeling it would be the same way with SAM, lots of people would cry for it to be a DPS or a Tank role and no matter the outcome people would still play it, because its a Samurai, and those players want to play as a Samurai.

So why not close the gap between roles in the game, if SE refuses to cater to those DPS left out (with queue times greater than 20min on average for 4 man dungeons and Duty Roulette) then they need to create more of what the game lacks, or find a way to cater to those DPS waiting in another form. Its quite simple, create more high-profile jobs as tanks and healers.

Edit: I should note, I enjoy all the constructive conversation happening here and I hope SE is listening, and I'm happy this topic has reached as many viewers/pages as it has. (that is all)

[Riastrad]

In fact lots of players that I know who were DRK (this is the correct abbreviation btw, not DKN) mains in FFXI (because you know us lol jobs--DRG and DRK--had to stick together between all that stigma) are still going to play DRK as a tank, not because of the role but because they wanted DRK and now they can get it. I have a feeling it would be the same way with SAM, lots of people would cry for it to be a DPS or a Tank role and no matter the outcome people would still play it, because its a Samurai, and those players want to play as a Samurai.

So why not close the gap between roles in the game, if SE refuses to cater to those DPS left out (with queue times greater than 20min on average for 4 man dungeons and Duty Roulette) then they need to create more of what the game lacks, or find a way to cater to those DPS waiting in another form. Its quite simple, create more high-profile jobs as tanks and healers.

You. I like you. You get it.

[myahele]

Ultimately, my main issue is the lack of creativity in regard to tanks. Assuming that SAM becomes a tank, whats next? A dual-wielding sword job?

[Riastrad]

So you suggest having less tanks added down the line? There is a reason why Dark is starting at 30 (Should have been 1 in my opinion), it's because while most of us have gotten past the storyline new players ie. the life blood of all MMO's, need a chance to clear older content.

Adding Samurai as a tank in the next expansion (not Heavensward) would make all those people that wanted to play as one tank. Much like how Dark Knight has become a tank even though some people held onto it becoming a Dps. My brother wanted it to be a Dps. Now it's a tank. He sucked it up and is moving forward with it. Maybe, just maybe, the same would happen for those Samurai lifers out there. Then all those Dps can finally get into a dungeon instead of crying on the forums about que times.

[EdwinLi]

Adding Samurai as a tank in the next expansion (not Heavensward) would make all those people that wanted to play as one tank.

Or they can release SAM for 3.X Update like Rog/Ninja to build up the hype for 2nd expansion (aka 4.0) if they have us heading into the Garlean Empire and Eastern Continent.

On that note I do hope they introduce new Jobs in 3.X era. I say Jobs beceasue releasing more than 1 new Job would be ideal to split the community between a new Tank and DPS or DPS and Healer or Tank and Healer Job release for 3.X era.