DPS display could easily be solved with a system already in game.

[kpxmanifesto]

Would kicking people for bad tanking or healing be allowable in DF groups? Why the double standard?

That question was purely rhetorical, thank you very much. No need to be edgy with an accusation of a double standard. By the way, I don't even see anybody bringing that up in this thread.

[Massterchef]

That question was purely rhetorical, thank you very much.

The fact that it's even a question, rhetoric or not, would suggest there is a double standard. Because kicking someone for their inability to perform their role beit tanking or healing is rarely questioned.

[kpxmanifesto]

The fact that it's even a question, rhetoric or not, would suggest there is a double standard. Because kicking someone for their inability to perform their role beit tanking or healing is rarely questioned.

That takes some serious mental gymnastics to arrive at that answer. As I said, no one even mentioned inability to perform tanking or healing roles. How did you even come to that conclusion? This sounds more like: "Oh, someone caught me in a logical fallacy. Might as well go along with it." Absolutely beyond reason. Can I quote you on that? It's actually kind of humorous.

[Eidolon]

That takes some serious mental gymnastics to arrive at that answer. As I said, no one even mentioned inability to perform tanking or healing roles. How did you even come to that conclusion? This sounds more like: "Oh, someone caught me in a logical fallacy. Might as well go along with it." Absolutely beyond reason.

Because we already see posts of people getting kicked for "Omg tank can't hold threat" and "omg healer let me die." It may not have happened to you, it may not have happened to your friends. But it DOES happen.

There are two times I get a que as in progress for a dungoun.

"Tank was an asshole."
"Tank couldn't hold threat."

I never get repped in on a DPS because "They couldn't do DPS", but this could be my own bias of not playing it as much.

[kpxmanifesto]

Because we already see posts of people getting kicked for "Omg tank can't hold threat" and "omg healer let me die." It may not have happened to you, it may not have happened to your friends. But it DOES happen.

There are two times I get a que as in progress for a dungoun.

"Tank was an asshole."
"Tank couldn't hold threat."

I never get repped in on a DPS because "They couldn't do DPS", but this could be my own bias of not playing it as much.

No, there were no posts before my initial post that said anything like that. My first post was on the first page. Just keep in mind that me and Masssterchef's exchange happened before anything tank related or healing related was even mentioned.

[Eidolon]

No, there were no posts before my initial post that said anything like that. My first post was on the first page.

hmn, perhaps I'm misunderstanding you guys (I'm a little loopy this morning. No idea why, sorry!)

But my understanding was, that she was basically saying we should be allowed to hold everyone to the same standard. We can see tanking/healing, because tanking = threat, and healing = my HP did(n't) hit 0, but there's no real way to hold DPS to the same standard as tanking/healing. Right now, a good tank and heal can basically outlive bad DPS. Likewise, a good DPS could kill something so fast that a bad healer or tank might not be as noticable.

What they were saying is that it seems somewhat unfair that you can kick Tanks/Heals for being Bad in their role, but if you show a DPS is bad in their role and someone wanted to remove a weaker link? That would somehow make them ... well...THE DEVIL

[kpxmanifesto]

snip

I get it. It's a good thing to hold everyone to the same standard. But it's also rude to just assume that someone holds a double standard.

[Massterchef]

That takes some serious mental gymnastics to arrive at that answer.

No it doesn't. Kicking people for the inability to perform their role is something that is generally accepted DF included. Majority of the situations that people usually justify kicking for lack of performance are bad tanking/healing and not DPS. The fact that a question has to be asked whether is it acceptable to kick a DPS for being incapable of fulfilling his role is what I'm suggesting is the double standard whether you view it that way or not. If you believe that everyone should be held accountable then good for you. That doesn't mean the double standard doesn't exist in the context of this thread.

[Elusana_Celah]

No it doesn't. Kicking people for the inability to perform their role is something that is generally accepted DF included.

I dunno, we had a really really god awful tank in a Halatali normal run once when I was leveling dragoon. So I equipped provoke and some enmity cross skills and proceeded to protect the healer and tank bosses cuz the tank could not hold hate at all. I used to try to help people learn but I have had too many experiences where i was being as nice as possible with my approach and I was met with "stfu" attitude. So instead of kicking the tank and waiting around for a new tank, I picked up his slack and we beat the dungeon.

What I feel the problem is is too many people are oversensitive to criticism. I feel like at times I can't be nice enough to someone and they would STILL turn hostile towards me. You have to accept criticism or you will never self-improve... Or at least be able to criticize yourself so you can see your flaws. A perfect example was this T12 group I was in. I watch the fireball go through our melee DPS and we wiped cuz of it so I immediately said,

"I guess melee DPS is in a zone and I ain't talking about the Auto Zone".
The dragoon says, "????"
I said, "The fireball blew up right next to you guys."
He said, "STFU The fireball passed right through us. Ohhh ohhh it's the melee DPS. Fkin our fault it can't be anyone else's fault."

And he just ranted on and on and on and on and on until I just called an abandon on the duty and it passed. Like really? That's why we have a player skill issue.

[kpxmanifesto]

No it doesn't. Kicking people for the inability to perform their role is something that is generally accepted DF included. Majority of the situations that people usually justify kicking for lack of performance are bad tanking/healing and not DPS. The fact that a question has to be asked whether is it acceptable to kick a DPS for being incapable of fulfilling his role is what I'm suggesting is the double standard whether you view it that way or not. If you believe that everyone should be held accountable then good for you. That doesn't mean the double standard doesn't exist in the context of this thread.

You went completely off topic. When did I ever mention tanks and healer roles at all? You're not getting the point I brought up whatsoever. I said nothing even remotely close that even resembled me condoning a double standard. You do know what a rhetorical question is, right? The point I brought up flew over your head completely. All that typing you just did for no reason.

My original topic: Nothing I said shows that I personally hold a double standard, yet you accuse me of it.