DPS display could easily be solved with a system already in game.

[Zaft]

It is still against the tos to admit to the usage of parsers and 3rd party tools

That's lip service and you know it. Nearly every person who streams streams with a parser visible, including every major FC. People discuss parsers in chat (party, linkshell, FC, hell even shout) all the time. And I've yet to hear of a single person besides the one person who started the whole "OMG PARSERS ARE ILLEGALZ" craze that has been reprimanded in any way, shape or form for using or admitting to use a parser.

[Welsper59]

That's lip service and you know it. Nearly every person who streams streams with a parser visible, including every major FC. People discuss parsers in chat (party, linkshell, FC, hell even shout) all the time. And I've yet to hear of a single person besides the one person who started the whole "OMG PARSERS ARE ILLEGALZ" craze that has been reprimanded in any way, shape or form for using or admitting to use a parser.

They don't exactly care about parsers by themselves if people don't misuse them, that's why. It's low on the priorities list of actions to take. It is however, a tool the GMs have leverage with to use to fight said players acts of harassment and bad behavior if it involves their use of it.

An old example.

[Kallera]

That's lip service and you know it. Nearly every person who streams streams with a parser visible, including every major FC. People discuss parsers in chat (party, linkshell, FC, hell even shout) all the time. And I've yet to hear of a single person besides the one person who started the whole "OMG PARSERS ARE ILLEGALZ" craze that has been reprimanded in any way, shape or form for using or admitting to use a parser.

I know this would require liberal use of the paint tool to back up for "lip service"

It still doesn't change that the frequency and prevalence of it would rise sharply, along with abuse of it as a social tool.

[Darra]

I fail to understand this whole "console users and PC users must have everything in equal measure" attitude. You play on a console by choice, that brings certain limitations. If you were serious when you say game play should be equal across both platforms, then you'd ask the devs to deliberately handicap PC and PS4 users so that they get the same load times as a PS3 does with certain effects, you'd also demand that PC users and PS4 users get FPS drops in the same places PS3 players do.

The entire argument against parsers is some ridiculous fear of being names and shamed or belittled by people misusing them. I personally could argue that it's insulting that you think so many people are assholes and want to be assholes. You've got a warped perspective on reality. I've asked multiple times and you people are yet to answer: Do you believe we should ban things, just because they can be misused? And if so, why are you not demanding a ban on /shout chat, /tell chat, and many other things outside of game, such as kitchen knives and cars, seeing as they can all be misused, by the minority.

How about you prove your arguments with evidence of these assholes in hiding, just waiting to pounce upon you and others for bad DPS. Is there some secret forum I don't know about where players talk about their fantasies of an official parser, just so they can be assholes?

[Massterchef]

Irrelevant stuff

Where are the consequences currently and why aren't they affecting you and other people en mass?

Their concerns, in most cases, have nothing to do with the fact that harassment is still against ToS. It's the frequency and the eventual look to have another tool to separate content, in this case, a wall set up by players to do even content like EX fights by having unrealistic expectations (i.e. requiring FCoB gear numbers to do LEX). By frequency, I mean the increased occurrence of douchebags being douchebags.

Just because something is against ToS doesn't mean they won't do it. Case in point: parsers (due to requiring a 3rd party program)... bots, hacks, buying gil, current harassment or violations of safety and privacy, etc. Their side isn't saying that it won't happen anyway, but they're arguing that the frequency is minimal at most right now, and they (along with the devs) like it that way. Speaking from experience that's why, it will happen far more often. Just as you use someones raid progress in this game against them, so too will someone use their actual numbers against them (irrelevant of their potential because of circumstance like gear differences). It's just one more thing to make people hate the game and the community that exists within it. If the devs see fit to ever make it official, then so be it. The side that doesn't like it will have to deal or leave. It's as simple as that. It doesn't change the fact that the devs, as far as we know, still don't want it to be an official thing for similar reasons that the players here are expressing. It also doesn't change the fact that a simple workaround, like the one I suggested, exists and the devs are A-OK with it for the most part.

A wall only exists when there is a DPS check hence the reason people primarily in the parser camp that do use parsers typically participate in endgame where there are a # of DPS checks. The reason you won't see extremes such as the LEX example you provided is because when content is nerfed and when player(s) are overgeared for content, DPS optimization is not a requirement. We can speculate all day about how the community will handle parser's but as you can already tell by the masses that use them, people rarely abuse them in outdated content. And it has nothing to do with the fact that they are outlawed by the ToS which is my point.

[Zaft]

They don't exactly care about parsers by themselves if people don't misuse them, that's why. It's low on the priorities list of actions to take. It is however, a tool the GMs have leverage with to use to fight said players acts of harassment and bad behavior if it involves their use of it.

An old example.

That's the exact image that I was talking about in my post. I've seen literally nothing beyond it of anybody being reprimanded. Ever.

I know this would require liberal use of the paint tool to back up for "lip service"

It still doesn't change that the frequency and prevalence of it would rise sharply, along with abuse of it as a social tool.

What do you describe "abuse" as? Is abuse me telling you that you're doing bad DPS? Is it me removing you because you aren't up to minimum standards for the content? I don't consider either of those as abuse. In fact, the only kind of "abuse" I can think of is somebody being extremely rude and assholeish to somebody else because of their DPS, and I've nearly never seen that happen on ANY game, even ones where nearly everybody uses a parsing tool (such as WoW).

[Massterchef]

An old example.

That's also not a good example considering it was a year ago and they admitted to giving out a lot of early bans. They are far more lenient on the issue. Got another example these past 3 months?

[siverstorm]

There still hasn't been an explanation as to why dps aren't held individually to the same basic expectations as tanks and healers.

Tanks and healers learn very quickly in this game that you need to play your job at least semi-competently, failure is usually met with a wipe (of course there are still exceptions and these exceptions are immediately ousted in groups).

But DPS literally get a free pass. Or if they're really bad they can have the rest of the group carry them and can justify playing poorly because they're protected by the ToS? No one has yet to explain how that makes sense.

I just think it's silly 9 times out of 10 no one is paying attention to a specific person, I could roll into dungeons on literally any class and play stupidly and it's okay?

"I'll just spam full thrust combos on drg, or just spam cast heavy shot and barely dot things on bard, maybe I'll go on my potato blm and cast blizzard for the entire dungeon, but good golly gosh I hope no one triggers me and says my dps is bad coz I'll just report them! "

I really hope that at least gets through to someone because that's not exactly far from an exaggeration....

[Welsper59]

A wall only exists when there is a DPS check hence the reason people primarily in the parser camp that do use parsers typically participate in endgame where there are a # of DPS checks. The reason you won't see extremes such as the LEX example you provided is because when content is nerfed and when player(s) are overgeared for content, DPS optimization is not a requirement. We can speculate all day about how the community will handle parser's but as you can already tell by the masses that use them, people rarely abuse them in outdated content. And it has nothing to do with the fact that they are outlawed by the ToS which is my point.

There's not a lot of speculation involved when history always repeats itself in this case. There's not a lot of speculation involved when I can provide evidence to showcase people doing bad things in similar ways. LEX was just an example. We could throw in Shiva, Ramuh, hardest 4-man dungeons, etc. It doesn't matter. People generally don't want to see, even if it doesn't directly affect them, further potential walls set up... especially unreasonable ones.

People rarely misuse them period because it's a matter that is against ToS. If mocking someones raid progress were against ToS, would you still freely do it? LOL That's the shield that the GMs/devs have to combat bad behavior. It has everything to do with the fact it's against ToS because of that.

That's the exact image that I was talking about in my post. I've seen literally nothing beyond it of anybody being reprimanded. Ever.

Speaking from experience of difficulty to "legally" reprimand people in a professional setting, the perpetrator playing dumb makes it even harder to act on first offense in many cases without previous AUPs (agreed upon procedures) or strict consequences ruled. This is why warnings are issued. Repeat offenses usually provide enough reasonable evidence that, without a shadow of a doubt, they are aware of and intentionally violating rules. I mean, if you truly believe what you say, you should test the waters and admit, in-game that you parse. Do a dungeon and gloat about your overwhelming numbers over others. Gloating is not an offense of itself afterall. If you encounter a GM, admit you are using a parse and tell them that you know nothing can happen to you as a result. See where that gets you, if you truly believe it.

[Massterchef]

There's not a lot of speculation involved when history always repeats itself in this case. There's not a lot of speculation involved when I can provide evidence to showcase people doing bad things in similar ways. LEX was just an example. We could throw in Shiva, Ramuh, hardest 4-man dungeons, etc. It doesn't matter. People generally don't want to see, even if it doesn't directly affect them, further potential walls set up... especially unreasonable ones.

I can provide examples of people misusing vote kick, thats pretty irrelevant to the fact that it still serves it's purpose and is used appropriately in majority cases. The fact is that fodder content like primals, dungeons don't have DPS checks that are difficult to meet because everyone outgears content by 20-40 ilvls. As such DPS optimization is not a requirement to clear the content so people won't construct their party requirements for optimization 99 times out of a 100. The 'wall' that you're talking about only exists for relevant content which you and majority of the people in this thread don't even pursue until you overgear the content and it's nerfed.

You can keep believing that's its not misused because of ToS. Like I said, lack of perspective will lead your reasoning towards that.