DPS display could easily be solved with a system already in game.

[Irie]

Had a rather brilliant case yesterday. Ilvl 125 Brd in AK hm, who barely scratched the 200 dps limit. They were bad. On an amazing and mindblowing level. But you know what, I stopped giving fucks about this long ago. This is not about numbers, this is about ppls mindset. Even if they knew how bad they are, I highly doubt that it would change anything. Ppl will just keep reusing the same excuses they always do in this forum: "it's just a game", "I want to have fun", "I play the way I want to", you fuckin name it.
Prob I'm just tired of trying to give advices and either get bitched at or get no reaction whatsoever. I'm tired of ppl who don't just underperform, but underperform in an insane, almost masterly way and my personal solution for that was just to not use DF or use it as little as possible.

So yeah, I'm all up for parsers, but I don't think that an ig implementation would change anything. Ppl who want to improve, will improve and those who just want "to play for fun" will stay where they are right now with or without parse tools.

(PS: sorry if it sounded overly dramatic, but I kinda resigned when it comes to the topic of bad dps).

[Sapphic]

So yeah, I'm all up for parsers, but I don't think that an ig implementation would change anything. Ppl who want to improve, will improve and those who just want "to play for fun" will stay where they are right now complaining on the forums about "elitists" not carrying them through content that's "too hard" for them.

Fixed for truth :P

[SDaemon]

Fixed for truth :P

Hilarious bias is hilarious

[Karen_Cerfrumos]

But why is removing a player from a party for low DPS is somehow unjust if it results in inability to clear a duty?
Coil... yeah, whatever. Cloud of Darkness, Steps of Faith, Ramuh EX phase 2, Amdapor Keep HM, goddamn Titan... These all feature DPS checks that can easily lead to a group-wide failure when not met.
The game does expect you to perform well already, being bad isn't against the ToS but it is against what game actually expects you to do.
Sticking your head into the sand with "you can't stop me from having fun" is exactly what leads to 50-page threads like "Steps of Faith is too hard, QQ". It's just hypocritical.
I know this sounds a bit like "You don't have anything to fear if you don't have anything to hide", but developers chose to put the aforementioned DPS checks in front of the players, even those that don't do what is officially considered the raid.

[Welsper59]

But why is removing a player from a party for low DPS is somehow unjust if it results in inability to clear a duty?
Coil... yeah, whatever. Cloud of Darkness, Steps of Faith, Ramuh EX phase 2, Amdapor Keep HM, goddamn Titan... These all feature DPS checks that can easily lead to a group-wide failure when not met.
The game does expect you to perform well already, being bad isn't against the ToS but it is against what game actually expects you to do.
Sticking your head into the sand with "you can't stop me from having fun" is exactly what leads to 50-page threads like "Steps of Faith is too hard, QQ". It's just hypocritical.
I know this sounds a bit like "You don't have anything to fear if you don't have anything to hide", but developers chose to put the aforementioned DPS checks in front of the players, even those that don't do what is officially considered the raid.

Depending on what's actually being said, it's not as hypocritical as you might think. Content outside of Coil is hardly what I would call a DPS check. Even with Cloud, properly/decently performing DPS (which does not, by any stretch of the imagination require parsing) will not prevent you from victory. Parsing is there to give you the extra bump in output timing (maybe around ~50 DPS extra in some cases), whereas knowing your class and rotation/priorities will get you the grand majority of output. Why do you believe parsing is the bulk of your output? I didn't take advantage of finding out my output at all in this game until recently, and right off the bat, I was pretty damn close to what I should have been with the gear I had.

My point is that it isn't objectively preventing anything at all. Groups will disband and reform without the low parsing dps, no harassment needed.

The point here being is that it isn't the "third party programs (parsers)" that SE is banning you for in this instance it's because you used it to harass someone. Square knows well that people use parsers and do not care, they just don't want you harassing people with it. But even with all of this there is still not a valid reason to not let a person see their OWN dps numbers. None at all.

"This is something you would NOT be able to do very easily if parsers were officially allowed"

^^ This is nothing more than assumption and there is no objective proof that allowing a person to see their own dps will make it "harder" to stop people from harassing each other. It's a non-sequitur. Harassment has and will be dealt with the same way it has always been.

Oh no no, I agree. It doesn't fully prevent anything at all. People are going to be... well, people. Laws are there to protect and prevent, but it doesn't mean we're not going to break them from time to time. I'm pointing out that the fact it's not officially allowed is merely protection, and as we all know, protection is not guaranteed to prevent. It's merely an extra layer, and given that SE knows about how useful parsing is when used appropriately, it's exactly why they don't mind people using it... just don't misuse it. Again, the current mentality is that its unofficial status keeps it a means to protect from those negative situations and reduce the occurrence of singled out players, nothing more.

[Magusrex]

No one wants to shamed, even if they might deserve it. I believe facts are good, I like transparency. In other games with meters people used to ask for my advice and help, because I was consistently a top performer. Other guilds invited me to their raids as guest and allowed me loot. When I first began raiding seeing myself at the bottom was my motivation to succeed. The key to improving at anything is keeping score. Over time I grew to really enjoy analyzing data to find ways to improve or succeed at an encounter very satisfying. We started timing our farming runs to make them interesting. I am not naive enough to not understand that some bad behaviors emerge from meters, I feel the benefits outweigh the negatives. I like the truth.

Almost no one is going to like what I am about to say. I am going to say it in such way as people will say..."That right there, that attitude is exactly why we don't want them" I don't care. A very small minority of people, really, really suck, they don't care that they suck, they don't care that their groups wipe over and over, they don't try to improve, they pay and they can play however they like, they expect you to carry them, they expect you not to complain about it, and they point you out as the bad guy if you do complain, and the last thing they want is for proof of the magnitude of their suck to be made public. It's Ok that you know they suck, but they can tell themselves they don't, and they believe it, meters make them have to face their suck over and over. Is what it is.

[Spawnie]

im aginst parsers for anything other then solo dungeons.. as much as people deny it, its gonna be abused as hell to those who arent performing to the "standards" others are expecting in most cases its just gonna turn into a giant pissing contest.. ur dps is to low i have a friend who wants to join whose dps is so much better then you so kicking you blah blah blah

vote kick system is already unfairly abused to new players for pretty petty reasons.. alot of people wont care if some1 is new or not asoon as they see low numbers = kicked

[Staris]

im aginst parsers for anything other then solo dungeons.. as much as people deny it, its gonna be abused as hell to those who arent performing to the "standards" others are expecting in most cases its just gonna turn into a giant pissing contest.. ur dps is to low i have a friend who wants to join whose dps is so much better then you so kicking you blah blah blah

vote kick system is already unfairly abused to new players for pretty petty reasons.. alot of people wont care if some1 is new or not asoon as they see low numbers = kicked

Agreed people might notice I afk after using a 1 button macro that attacks every 20 seconds in CT/ST.

[Spawnie]

Agreed people might notice I afk after using a 1 button macro that attacks every 20 seconds in CT/ST.

lol im a noob with that stuff didnt even know what macro was b4 started playing ff14 XD n dont even use any in game :P

[Shadray]

I don't see a problem with the way it is now, everyone has them, you can talk about them with friends, but you can't target people in game with the results.

What's the problem?