Does instant transportation effect game immersion?

[Bled]

Oh what's this
It's "Desktop Dungeons", a game based entirely around fighting enemies and getting stronger, and with very short playtimes to boot!

Your turn, show me a game based entirely around being immersed in idling, where players look forward to the dread of doing anything because of the massive amount of time it takes just to start!

Of course, if that's your thing, there's nothing stopping you from enjoying that experience!
Unless for some reason that joy comes from forcing that experience on other people rather than from the experience itself.

Can you read? I ask because if you read my above post you would realize how much you just embarrassed yourself.

Popular games that focus on immersion, in their mechanics: Call of Duty's, Gears of War, majority of Final Fantasy, Lost odesy, FIFA, and NHL, all of these games use immersing their customers into a second reality where the person can visualized themselves there. Standing on an airship between cities is just a small part of the over all mechanic of immersion. If you don't like that then fine but don't get on your soap box and scream that all immersion is idle standing.

Now get out of that one track/over exaggerating mind set and maybe you can see that there can be more to a game then PEW PEW PEW.

[Jaber]

Can you read? I ask because if you read my above post you would realize how much you just embarrassed yourself.

Popular games that focus on immersion, in their mechanics: Call of Duty's, Gears of War, majority of Final Fantasy, Lost odesy, FIFA, and NHL, all of these games use immersing their customers into a second reality where the person can visualized themselves there. Standing on an airship between cities is just a small part of the over all mechanic of immersion. If you don't like that then fine but don't get on your soap box and scream that all immersion is idle standing.

Now get out of that one track/over exaggerating mind set and maybe you can see that there can be more to a game then PEW PEW PEW.

You sir are confusing immersion with waiting.
The immersion in call of duty is not done by forcing you to sit in the back of a plane for fifteen minutes while you fly to a dropzone. The immersion in FIFA is not done by having the player wait in a locker room for half an hour while all the fans pour into the stadium(or at all, now that I think on it, since sports games are most always presented in a manner similar to watching a game on TV).
Likewise, the immersion in FFXIV does not benefit from excessive travel times or waiting on an airship, though it does simulate that experience quite well in that I'll end up playing a handheld game whether I'm waiting on an airship in-game or waiting on a plane in real life.

[Bled]

You sir are confusing immersion with waiting.
The immersion in call of duty is not done by forcing you to sit in the back of a plane for fifteen minutes while you fly to a dropzone. The immersion in FIFA is not done by having the player wait in a locker room for half an hour while all the fans pour into the stadium.
Likewise, the immersion in FFXIV does not benefit from excessive travel times or waiting on an airship, though it does simulate that experience quite well in that I'll end up playing a handheld game whether I'm waiting on an airship in-game or waiting on a plane in real life.

you are confusing what you don't enjoy in a game with what immersion is actually defined as and used for. at some points in life standing and looking out at a scenic view, or waiting for a trip to end is part of a immersive factor. Again i would like to emphasize standing still is not all that immersion is but rather 1/10000000 of a part of immersion, as NPC's actually moving around a city would be another 1/10000000 of immersion. Slowing down is not naturally a bad thing in a game, but this new emerging mind set believes that gear scores, and raid running is the only appropriate mechanic of a game; so hey if that's what gets you off i suggest looking outside of the final fantasy franchise.

[Jaber]

you are confusing what you don't enjoy in a game with what immersion is actually defined as and used for. at some points in life standing and looking out at a scenic view, or waiting for a trip to end is part of a immersive factor. Again i would like to emphasize standing still is not all that immersion is but rather 1/10000000 of a part of immersion as NPC actually moving around a city would be another 1/10000000 of immersion. Slowing down is not naturally a bad thing in a game, but this new emerging mind set believes that gear scores, and raid running is the only appropriate mechanic of a game so hey if that what you enjoy i suggest looking outside of the final fantasy franchise.

Which is why I asked you for examples of games that are popular because people enjoy having to wait without having the option to do otherwise. I don't understand why you cannot enjoy your waiting while other people have the option of not waiting if they so choose(since it's pretty obvious from all the topics that it's quite a divided issue).
Because you won't have anyone to wait with? If it was something everyone enjoyed, why wouldn't there be anyone to wait with? If it's forced, the people who don't enjoy it are just going to be AFK, and you end up no better off while they end up inconvenienced.

[Bled]

Which is why I asked you for examples of games that are popular because people enjoy having to wait without having the option to do otherwise. I don't understand why you cannot enjoy your waiting while other people have the option of not waiting if they so choose(since it's pretty obvious from all the topics that it's quite a divided issue).
Because you won't have anyone to wait with? If it was something everyone enjoyed, why wouldn't there be anyone to wait with? If it's forced, the people who don't enjoy it are just going to be AFK, and you end up no better off while they end up inconvenienced.

Before the skip cut scene feature, waiting was a huge part of video games, so do i really need to list them off for you? Even in call of duty there are parts of the game where you are forced to watch a scene play out before you. You say whats so bad allowing people the option to insta telepot i re rebuttal with Abysea from FF11.

When SE created abysea in FF11 they said "o hey guys abysea wont ruin anything because people can still choose to experience the old content". well guess what it did ruin FF11, by creating content that is so drastically different and "easy access" that makes old content obsolete, you pigonhole people into having to use the new content. In reality by introducing all of this new instant gratification content all old content and immersion is becoming obsolete thus forcing people to use said new instant gratification while masking its true cause by saying "were giving you the option to choose".

Choice is over rated, especially when the people choosing are as smart as your common household cat.

[Jaber]

Before the skip cut scene feature, waiting was a huge part of video games, so do i really need to list them off for you? Even in call of duty there are parts of the game where you are forced to watch a scene play out before you. You say whats so bad allowing people the option to insta telepot i re rebuttal with Abysea from FF11.

Yes, please list them off for me. Only the ones where the forced waiting adds to the game, mind you, not the ones where you mistake being unable to skip things to be a gameplay element.
For example.. Final Fantasy Tactics Advance comes to mind as a game that would have benefited greatly from not having to sit through the halfhour long intro/tutorial. It was bearable the first time. It's kept me from replaying it ever again, though. Like an airship ride, not something I'd want to have to sit through multiple times whether I'm sick of it or not without any choice in the matter.

BTW, your argument boils down to "if people have access to content that's easier to enjoy, they're going to choose it over other content"
Which is really not much of an argument at all.

And I counter your Abysea with Chains of Promathia, which was an enormous pain in the dick to complete because very few people were willing to do it again after experiencing it once, even after level sync negated the requirement of buying new gear sets for 30, 40, 50, and 60! GL getting a group willing to do promyvions with you, let alone one that's capable of clearing it, even after spending hours farming for items to weaken the boss!

[Azurymber]

Yes, please list them off for me. Only the ones where the forced waiting adds to the game, mind you, not the ones where you mistake being unable to skip things to be a gameplay element.
For example.. Final Fantasy Tactics Advance comes to mind as a game that would have benefited greatly from not having to sit through the halfhour long intro/tutorial. It was bearable the first time. It's kept me from replaying it ever again, though. Like an airship ride, not something I'd want to have to sit through multiple times whether I'm sick of it or not without any choice in the matter.

BTW, your argument boils down to "if people have access to content that's easier to enjoy, they're going to choose it over other content"
Which is really not much of an argument at all.

And I counter your Abysea with Chains of Promathia, which was an enormous pain in the dick to complete because very few people were willing to do it again after experiencing it once, even after level sync negated the requirement of buying new gear sets for 30, 40, 50, and 60! GL getting a group willing to do promyvions with you, let alone one that's capable of clearing it, even after spending hours farming for items to weaken the boss!

i found CoP easy to do. And almost everyone got it done. It was a challenge. It made it that much more special when you got past the promys. Once you got level sync and could use high level gear i dont know many ppl who had problems with it. On my server ppl who shouted in town got a party together in less than 30min usually.

[Bled]

Yes, please list them off for me. Only the ones where the forced waiting adds to the game, mind you, not the ones where you mistake being unable to skip things to be a gameplay element.
For example.. Final Fantasy Tactics Advance comes to mind as a game that would have benefited greatly from not having to sit through the halfhour long intro/tutorial. It was bearable the first time. It's kept me from replaying it ever again, though. Like an airship ride, not something I'd want to have to sit through multiple times whether I'm sick of it or not without any choice in the matter.

BTW, your argument boils down to "if people have access to content that's easier to enjoy, they're going to choose it over other content"
Which is really not much of an argument at all.

And I counter your Abysea with Chains of Promathia, which was an enormous pain in the dick to complete because very few people were willing to do it again after experiencing it once, even after level sync negated the requirement of buying new gear sets for 30, 40, 50, and 60! GL getting a group willing to do promyvions with you, let alone one that's capable of clearing it, even after spending hours farming for items to weaken the boss!

Human nature; present a caveman with magically cooked chicken that appears before him or force him to hunt, then kill, then find a way to cook the chicken. Of course the cave man would choose the magical cooked chicken appearing before his eyes, however guess what he had to hunt, then kill, then find a way to cook the chicken. So because the cave man had to take the hard road he learned more along the way like fire, hunting, skinning, bone craving, weapon making. Can you stop and even imagine where we would be today if everything was just given to us!?!?

Human nature is to take the easy way out so if you present game content that has easy content and hard content it is only natural for a person to choose easy content. In this respect people should not have any choice or say in the games development.

Edit: and again you are confusing your own impatiences for what immersion actually is.

[Nabiri]

When SE created abysea in FF11 they said "o hey guys abysea wont ruin anything because people can still choose to experience the old content". well guess what it did ruin FF11, by creating content that is so drastically different and "easy access" that makes old content obsolete, you pigonhole people into having to use the new content. In reality by introducing all of this new instant gratification content all old content and immersion is becoming obsolete thus forcing people to use said new instant gratification while masking its true cause by saying "were giving you the option to choose".

And this is why I'm having a hard time going back to XI lately. Currently on break, not paying for it. Abyssea took over the game and made everything easy mode - especially leveling. It was fun for a while but now that I've done it I'm bored. I've gotten everything I wanted from it - now what? lol No one plays the rest of the game anymore. The game I loved is pretty much dead.
Though I get it in a way - the game is old, it needed to attract new players. It's just sad to see XIV handing everything out without any effort on the players' part from the start of the game.
Handing out things on a silver platter = bad idea.