Does instant transportation effect game immersion?

[Jobeto-Rin]

In general, an MMO's success thrives from sustaining players in the game.

A game containing challenging obstacles that impede in-game goals, be it the time to accomplish agendas; depth of difficulty, a time-sink in its own right; or a plethora of content to complete, not only compliment the chances of success but requires that a player pertains diligence, separating the hardcore from the casual, and grants a feeling of accomplishment & enjoyment once those impediments are perished.

So IMO, instant transportation does warrant less immersion.

Games with easily accessible shortcuts diminishes it's difficulty and staying power.

[Commat]

Games with easily accessible shortcuts diminishes it's difficulty and staying power.

Agreed, so lets have a fun, long and rewarding adventure to gain airship passes.

Not we pay a guy 500gil to ride an AFKship.

K?

[Jobeto-Rin]

Agreed, so lets have a fun, long and rewarding adventure to gain airship passes.

Not we pay a guy 500gil to ride an AFKship.

K?

Or better yet...

How about a long and rewarding airship pass quest, like you mentioned.

& quests requiring us to board an airship?

Win-win situation

[Rhomagus]

In general, an MMO's success thrives from sustaining players in the game.

A game containing challenging obstacles that impede in-game goals, be it the time to accomplish agendas; depth of difficulty, a time-sink in its own right; or a plethora of content to complete, not only compliment the chances of success but requires that a player pertains diligence, separating the hardcore from the casual, and grants a feeling of accomplishment & enjoyment once those impediments are perished.

So IMO, instant transportation does [not] warrant less immersion.

Games with easily accessible shortcuts diminishes it's difficulty and staying power.

I now agree with this statement.

You even state it in your post:

depth of difficulty, a time-sink in its own right;

We don't need to waste time for wasting time's sake. We are already utilizing time in order to accomplish difficult objectives. Non-instant transportation does not add difficulty unless there is actual content to accompany it.

This fails to take into account being given the freedom to "take the road less traveled", and that makes, "all the difference".

[Jobeto-Rin]

I now agree with this statement.

You even state it in your post:


We don't need to waste time for wasting time's sake. We are already utilizing time in order to accomplish difficult objectives. Non-instant transportation does not add difficulty unless there is actual content to accompany it.

This fails to take into account being given the freedom to "take the road less traveled", and that makes, "all the difference".

Anything that takes time requires us to be more involved, hence immersion. MMO's thrive off of that. That is the notion I was trying to provide.

I'm not trying to imply that we need to waste time, in order to provide immersion. Nor did I mean to insinuate that non-insta traveling provides difficulty. Those were 3 different variables that effect immersion in a MMO. Goals that don't require time spent to achieve them, more than likely, feel less rewarding than those that do.

A road less traveled and instant shortcut are not interchangeable.

Read my 2nd post, if you have no time....

We are supposed to make time for MMO's. Not the other way around.

[Rhomagus]

Anything that takes time requires us to be more involved, hence immersion. MMO's thrive off of that. That is the notion I was trying to provide.

I'm not trying to imply that we need to waste time, in order to provide immersion. Nor did I mean to insinuate that non-insta traveling provides difficulty. Those were 3 different variables that effect immersion in a MMO. Goals that don't require time spent to achieve them, more than likely, feel less rewarding than those that do.

A road less traveled and instant shortcut are not interchangeable.

Read my 2nd post, if you have no time....

We are supposed to make time for MMO's. Not the other way around.

A road less traveled and instant shortcut are not interchangeable.

You read it wrong, the road less traveled is actually the less convenient one. Nature follows the path of least resistance. In essence, the metaphor here applies to the immersionist not the person wanting convenience.

Anything that takes time requires us to be more involved

AFK on an airship involves me how again?

Read my 2nd post, if you have no time....

I've read your second post and agree with you in some aspects, if only a few. I've edited them accordingly in my response to reflect a fair compromise and the philosophies I too would like implemented.

We are supposed to make time for MMO's. Not the other way around.

Absolutely disagree with you on this, and I think the disclaimer that you accept before playing every time would also like a word with you. Forgetting your family, skipping school and work, and creating room in life for the purpose of "making time" in an MMO is not healthy nor condoned by Square Enix. I play an MMO in my "downtime". I don't "make time" for it. That's absolutely ridiculous and is the very crux of our design philosophies here.

If you respond, also take into account I've never played any other MMO besides Final Fantasy XI. I've never even tried WoW. This is not a WoW vs FF argument. Nor is it a churn and burn vs. immersion argument. It's an options vs. no options argument.

[Jobeto-Rin]

You read it wrong, the road less traveled is actually the less convenient one. Nature follows the path of least resistance. In essence, the metaphor here applies to the immersionist not the person wanting convenience.



AFK on an airship involves me how again?



I've read your second post and agree with you in some aspects, if only a few. I've edited them accordingly in my response to reflect a fair compromise and the philosophies I too would like implemented.



Absolutely disagree with you on this, and I think the disclaimer that you accept before playing every time would also like a word with you. Dumping a girlfriend, skipping work, forgetting your schoolwork is "making" time for an MMO. I play an MMO in my "downtime". I don't "make time" for it. That's absolutely ridiculous and is at the very crux of our philosophical argument here.

I'm not sure I understand the ridiculousness of setting aside time to play a game, that should be immersive and involve time in the first place.

I think your forgetting MMO's are supposed to be another world to be involved in, a game in which you can temporarily forget about other issues. Which is the point of the disclaimer, don't forget RL.

Now MMO's are just another game to be played and rushed through.

[Synapse]

Now MMO's are just another game to be played and rushed through.

Yup welcome to the retarded Log in > loading Screen > NPC > Loading Screen > MOB > Loading NPC > Loading Screen > Log out.

Can you feel the enjoyment!!!?

[Jobeto-Rin]

If you respond, also take into account I've never played any other MMO besides Final Fantasy XI. I've never even tried WoW. This is not a WoW vs FF argument. Nor is it a churn and burn vs. immersion argument. It's an options vs. no options argument.

Understood.

When you heard of a MMO game, (to me at least) immediate reactions of a game virtual world arose. From the detailed intricacies of what entailed a MMO game; An in-game clock, with it's own periods of night and day; applicable real world weather, snow, desert storms, etc etc.; Real life people oriented groups, shops, clans, gangs, entourages, posses etc.; To engaging environments, mountains, oceans, vast lands, cities and villages. You knew it would be massive and would take time to go through the necessities to create what you would deem as a virtual image of yourself and venture this world. The time invested wasn't relevant, it was the the thrill of experiencing the game and enjoying the e-world with other people and their own unique characters, that mattered.

Now fast forward to the aftermath of WOW. Players say they have no time, now it's just a game they throw hours into and just level up, vicinities filled with egotistical people trying to attain the greatest gear and highest level as quickly as possible, largest LS, all for bragging rights. No more dedication is required really, it's just become another game to play. MMO's are loosing it's essence.

I believe casuals, and the money they offered to game companies, swayed the change of this, but above is old school MMO's to me, it seems times are changing. There's so much more to say.

Money ruins so much crap man.

[Azurymber]

Understood.

When you heard of a MMO game, (to me at least) immediate reactions of a game virtual world arose. From the detailed intricacies of what entailed a MMO game; An in-game clock, with it's own periods of night and day; applicable real world weather, snow, desert storms, etc etc.; Real life people oriented groups, shops, clans, gangs, entourages, posses etc.; To engaging environments, mountains, oceans, vast lands, cities and villages. You knew it would be massive and would take time to go through the necessities to create what you would deem as a virtual image of yourself and venture this world. The time invested wasn't relevant, it was the the thrill of experiencing the game and enjoying the e-world with other people and their own unique characters, that mattered.

Now fast forward to the aftermath of WOW. Players say they have no time, now it's just a game they throw hours into and just level up, vicinities filled with egotistical people trying to attain the greatest gear and highest level as quickly as possible, largest LS, all for bragging rights. No more dedication is required really, it's just become another game to play. MMO's are loosing it's essence.

I believe casuals, and the money they offered to game companies, swayed the change of this, but above is old school MMO's to me, it seems times are changing. There's so much more to say.

Money ruins so much crap man.

Its also companies failing to realize how to make a profit these days.
You can:
A: copy the best guy
which almost always results in a failed product

or
B: Take whats good from the best guy and create something new and innovative.

This game was originally innovative and if released a year later would have probably been very successful.
ex. everyone says the world is copy/pasted, but if you explore you'll notice almost all the little nodes covered in 1-shot kill things are unique looking and not copy pasted in any way (cept coerthas)

with a change in devs it has turned into a complete copy of WoW though.