Entitled DPS, please stop being entitled

[silentwindfr]

snips

i will be blunt, try to do a dungeon where the lead is not the tank, please try and be the tank!
it's painfull, you are simply repeat your oversimplified cycle and can't even decide on what you gonna hit first, since someone point you what you must pull or stuff like this.

indeed dungeon are teamwork, but each role have a jobs.... the dps have more complexe cycle and tool for burn down the monster as fast as possible while avoiding useless damage
healer must heal the tank and make sure the team survive while be carefull for themself.
the tank is the lead into this, he will be the one to decide if he can or cannot pull more or less. the one to know when he can or must use a Cooldown that will lessen the burden on the healer.

we can argue all the day about this, but even in a team you need a leader, why? because if you don't have a leader everyone will go wherever they want while doing whatever they want. you need someone to point where the team must focus them attention and effort. tank are the one that must do it, because they can survive what they gonna pull, not the dps nor the healer.... especially since we have only one provoke with a huge cd.... the game it's make around this! you can try to make the tank look like the bad guys.

but that the reality of the game in dungeon. now that don't means that tank have all right, that a given, but that don't mean that the other have more right than the tank. it's true the other can ask the tank to do something, but it's too the right of the tank to refuse. impose your will to the tank is more rude than a tank ignoring the will of the group. you talk of jerk and stuff.... me i'm talking about respect. that quite different.

[SDaemon]

WoW was way easier on tanking than what we have here. no stuff to spam for retake the aggros or stuff like this. anyway, that not the trouble, i wasn't aiming anyone in particular, but i'm clear, in DF tank is the lead.... that must'nt be changed or seriously the number of tank will drop more and more. because you will have no fun at all at play tank. they have oversimplified cycle of skill, without this control over the situation we are not different than a pet and will make the experience simply unbearable.

While the tank is in charge of pulling and holding aggro that doesn't make them the boss. Their skill level and role are just the most pronounced when setting the pace of the dungeon/content. The tank could want to skip every trash pack skip-able, but if the rest of the group wants to down the things for exp, whelp the tank is going to have fun tanking those trash packs.

[silentwindfr]

The tank could want to skip every trash pack skip-able, but if the rest of the group wants to down the things for exp, whelp the tank is going to have fun tanking those trash packs.

tank are not the slave of the group.... like i have said, even if the 3 other want, if the tank don't want he is not forced to it. it's not a democracy... it's fair, everyone is there for have fun, if the tank don't want to pull everything.... he is not forced to go with the will of the group. if you want to make clean sweep in dungeon use PF!

[SDaemon]

tank are not the slave of the group.... like i have said, even if the 3 other want, if the tank don't want he is not forced to it. it's not a democracy... it's fair, everyone is there for have fun, if the tank don't want to pull everything.... he is not forced to go with the will of the group. if you want to make clean sweep in dungeon use PF!

The group isn't the tank's slave harem. If the other 3 in the party want to do something, the tank has three choices; to do it, leave or be kicked. The party group is most certainly a democracy. If the tank doesn't want to tank the trash the rest of the group wants to fight then he is free to leave.

[Hyrist]

90% of the tank's job actually entails being group leader...>.> Otherwise we shouldn't be the ones shouldering the blame every time healers or DPS fail at their jobs.

Only idiots force blame purely on another. Give tips and reasoning and you work together to solve problems. Tanks that get shouldered the blame for a groups failings aren't alone in their burden. Healers and DPS get blamed all the time.

That's the blame game that's the problem, not an excuse to carry the 'leader' delusion.

You're "on point" not "leader". You're the first monkey forward in a group of four monkeys all doing their jobs. It's wrong for any of the monkeys to fling their dung around.

[Jynx]

if you want to make clean sweep in dungeon use PF!

If you want to set your own rules I suggest you take your own advice. In the duty finder your at the mercy of the majority, if you don't like it feel free to leave and save everyone the hassle of cattering to your special snowflake syndrom.

[Ashkendor]

How I feel reading this thread right now:

[Sigiria]

Tanks are not the boss of anyone. It's a mmo, it's played by a community, if you think you are entitled to rule the party you're mistaken. The tank job is to keep the hate of the mobs on him, the easiest way to do that is to get initial enmity, that why you pull them, it don't mean you can decide by yourself how the run will go.
In dungeon tank are not as essential as they think they are. Did with friends most of the latest dungeon with 4dps/4heal/4tank out of boredom, and had no problem getting a clear, every dungeon could pretty much be done with a 4 monkey team anyway.
If you do end game content you understand really fast that tank are not more valuable than any other member of the team, everyone as to get their game together to get a clear, if you play alone or even fight against your own team you're getting nowhere

Sometimes the attitude of the tanks in this game is really sad. (note that it's not only tank, they are everywhere) Once I got Shiva trial on duty as a smn, trying to get my egi on manual I accidently send it on the boss, proceed to explain and apologize asap. Tanks get in an corner and said you pull, you tank. I actually agree with that but maybe mistake happen, and if someone take the time to explain and say he's sorry it's probably really a mistake. Answer of the tank: "I don't care, I'm the tank I get to decide anyway". in the meantime 4 people die get raised and he decide that his ego his satisfied and pull. I tell him it wasn't very mature of him and once again he reply with "yeah but you're just a dps, I'm the tank, what are you gonna do about it?" and here's happened a kinda cool reality check, 4 dps that didn't know each other before proceeded to sheathe their weapon and started cheer on the tank, that suddenly got all quiet, 10min later and dps wondering if Shiva hard had an enrage before her astral party finally wipe and disband. Sure it wasn't very mature either, but it proved that you can't treat people whatever you want just because you're tank. (I tagged again afterward, got Shiva again with the same tank, we talked like human being before the start instead of acting like kids and got a fast clear)

In OP's specific case. Yeah the dps could've been more polite asking a full run, but he could've explained it to him. As him and his friend wanted it quick I'll assume he were more prompt to react with hostility rather than work a way to satistfy everyone.
It was selfish and not very mature on both part. In that case his friend needed a clear, the other 2 wanted the exp, doing the full run was longer but satisfied both side. But rather than sort it out at the start it did go. dps: Xp k bye -> screw this I'm the boss, I am the hero, I am the tank you'll do what I want -> tank proceed to run through selfishly -> dps aggro everything for his gain selfishly -> everyone act like kid and refuse to work together -> party disband -> new "people don't do it like I want to" thread on the forum.
Maybe one side had to show a bit of maturity and this could've been avoided.

[Fynlar]

Uh... is it me or people are cherry picking the OP's post to argue against it just for the sake of arguing?

Congratulations; you've discovered the VERY PURPOSE of these forums.

[Cyrus-Wallace]

Let me explain the difference between LEADER and BOSS:



Thanks for your time.

Congratulations; you've discovered the VERY PURPOSE of these forums.

Most of the people that are raging against OP, looks like they had a bad experience with tanks, which doesn't mean all the tanks are like that. And as far as I can see, the sole idea of having a leader, freak people out and they spit out poison from every hole of their bodies. Taking things out of context or, as I said, cherry picking what they want to read just to argue against it. It's sad, because that leads to an unhealthy discussion and it "drains" OP's energy trying to clarify what he already said over and over.