I don't want to use parsers

[Zaft]

snippity swoogy

The difference is that in WoW, you can be called out for being garbage. On FFXIV, we're not allowed to hurt your feelings, lest we risk the wrath of the GMs.

I was doing a PUG Mythic Highmaul a few days back. We were wiping because we weren't being healed through the AoE phases. Check the parse, noticed two of the healers were playing terribly, replaced them, beat it. Wow, whodathunkit.

[Crescent_Dusk]

To be honest with how technically inept some people like me are, I'd love in-game parsers so I don't have to play around installing something as ridiculously unintuitive as the ACT parser+overlay, which doesn't even work full screen after I've gone through more than half an hour installing and setting that one thing up.

I want my weak auras 2 in this game.

[Felessan]

So, my question is: Without parsers, since they're illegal and to be honest they're not that clarifying, how could we make this better? Do you think some kind of scoreboard like the PvP ones would work? As in, total damage after the fight ends?
What does everyone think? Because, I don't wanna use parsers, but I don't wanna carry people either.

You want to improve your own performance (or your static people or people you know) or just some random people from DF/PF? If you want latter - to harass people because they have weak performance - it's an offense that might lead to problems with GMs.
There are an indirect ways to check performance - if you know rotation of given class - you can just look what people are doing. Hate order is also a good indicator of clearly underperforming people. But discrimination based on such criteria formally not permitted in the very same way as parsers do - so if you want to silently breach 1 rule, why not breach 2 of them and just use parser.

The difference is that in WoW, you can be called out for being garbage. On FFXIV, we're not allowed to hurt your feelings, lest we risk the wrath of the GMs.

People do it in PF parties all the time, they just do not state the source of information, simply "you are bad, we'll replace you".

[jack891]

Parsers r jus bad, dont want them. Really dont wanna see people in PF saying do X amount of damage or be kicked it wud jus ruin the community which for the most part is way better than most other mmos imo.
I would however like a personal dps meter only i can see so i can take it upon myself to improve my rotation and damage output

[AyaLiz]

The only reason calling people out for poor performance is troublesome right now because all parsers are third party software and as such against the terms of service. Addon support is already being worked on (with the most recent news I am aware of being http://www.gamespot.com/articles/ff-.../1100-6425730/ ) and at that point someone might just develop a simple DPS meter addon that will resolve the problem of not being able to get DPS numbers without third party software at which point this discussion will be rather pointless.

How accurate an addon DPS meter would be is a little questionable since some damage over time effects currently aren't being tracked by the battle log and third party parsers just get that data by reading game memory which addons more than likely won't have access to. As such, unless they fix battle log being rather incomplete by the time there's addon support, DPS meter addons would probably spit out really inaccurate numbers. However, it would make for a great excuse for calling someone out for low DPS. Earlier last year someone got a warning for mentioning parsers in chat: http://i.imgur.com/OX7Z2yt.jpg
Now imagine if a DPS addon, even a very inaccurate one, existed. That GM would no longer have anything to warn this person for if he said that he got the numbers from a DPS addon and of course, nothing is stopping him from also running a more accurate third party parser to get real numbers from and saying that the numbers are from an addon when someone asks.

Edit: Of course, it still all depends on how you go about telling people that they are performing poorly. Telling someone "you're shit go uninstall" is going to get you warned/banned no matter whether or not you tell them the numbers on a parser. Having the DPS numbers readily available won't make people any more toxic because toxic behavior is going to get them banned either way.

[pandabearcat]

The only reason this is even a problem is because the combat log is just, the most useless crap ever. Pretty much the worst out of any modern MMO.

Addons are gonna be useless until they make the combat log useful.

[DSaint]

op main post.

I do believe players like you are the main reason because we do not have parsers.
Ok, don't get me wrong: I'm not saying you're not right or you are a bad player or your reason to want a parse are illegitimate. But I think SE do not want to give one more reason ( a good and legitimate reason or not) to players to kick each other. It's bad for business. Bad players and good players pay that exactly same subscription.

One more time: I'm not saying you're wrong! But, in my opinion SE do not want players with this kind of behavior.

[Crescent_Dusk]

I do believe players like you are the main reason because we do not have parsers.
Ok, don't get me wrong: I'm not saying you're not right or you are a bad player or your reason to want a parse are illegitimate. But I think SE do not want to give one more reason ( a good and legitimate reason or not) to players to kick each other. It's bad for business. Bad players and good players pay that exactly same subscription.

One more time: I'm not saying you're wrong! But, in my opinion SE do not want players with this kind of behavior.

They will kick players with or without parses. Go into turn 10. The new player has watched the boss video, but what the boss video doesn't tell them is that people sneak by adds before the boss. The tank goes to sneak without saying anything, new player follows him, stuff aggroes and tank flips his crap and wants to kick the new guy for messing up the sneak.

Same goes for sons and daughters, the video from MTQ just says to kill the adds on one side before moving to the next. Common practice is to kill the daughters first then the sons so once again another kickable offense in the dutyfinder.

Really, parses don't make any difference with intolerance by people for ignorant/new players even in spaces designed for new players such as dutyfinder (any person with expectations should be using partyfinder premades or use his guild static anyways).

In fact, add ons help far more to mitigate ignorant play than hiding them. If you have something like DBM which broadcasts the goal of each phase of a fight and warns you for debuffs and what to do about them like in WoW, ignorant players have a lesser chance of burdening a group.

Parses are a good thing. Any tool that facilitates information processing for faster and more efficient decision making and helps with raid awareness is a GOOD thing for everyone.

Intolerant assholes will continue to be such with or without parses. Tools don't change the attitude/personality of a player.

[m3eansean]

I would however like a personal dps meter only i can see so i can take it upon myself to improve my rotation and damage output

Information is useless in a vacuum. You would never know if your personal dps is good or not if it is not shared with others. DPS meters must be group visible for them to be effective at all.

[The_Last_Dragoon]

The problem with Parsers is that certain jobs will absolutely do more dps than others given different situations. It's not right if the introduction of a parser leads to players forcing out certain classes because god forbid they can't do as much damage as a Monk with a stationary target. No, in fact I'm pretty sure that the introduction of an in-client Parser will only lead to arguments over players who aren't putting out the numbers. There's a reason why Bards can't do the same damage as a Monk and honestly, I'd be appalled if they changed the game so that they could.