Do you think sell groups are hurting end game community?

[Elusana_Celah]

I'm looking for opinions here. My server currently has anywhere between 1-6 selling groups in party finder all day long (depending on peak hours or not).

As players try to get their clears or farms going, many players are skilled but just can't get other skilled players to join them so it ends up being a lot of wiping before you can see some success.

The question to be asked is: Would people who sell the runs bother to join and help out other skilled people in clears or farms? I personally have not seen the known run sellers in anything I have done. There is no profit to be made by helping others, is that the mentality of run sellers? I cannot say for sure.

This is why I'm leaving this open for opinions and other views. Perhaps supporting run selling only makes things worse for you and everyone else, perhaps it doesn't matter at all.

[Mercutial]

Dear Lord yes... have you ever tried "farming" content with individuals you know for a fact bought their clears? FCOB farm parties are littered with these individuals and many suffer as a result. And yes... I'll go on record as saying that every single person I know who has bought a clear has not put nearly the amount of time needed into actually beating the content. And almost to a single one, it's about getting gear. NOT cut scenes. Gear to show off to others that was bought.

Just my experience, but it has held true and nearly every case I've witnessed.

[Spy]

I personally detest it...if you can't clear the content with your own skill then you dont deserve to pass it...but who am I to tell other people how to play the game or spend their gil? Luckily, raid selling isnt a problem here on my server really. I guess that's why we don't have RMT LOL

I know raid's aren't completely dependant on one person, so perhaps I'm being a little "unfair" but I still absolutely HATE run selling....to the core! It seriously disgusts me! Maybe it's why I'm so poor in the game...because I'm not willing to take advantage of other's inability to get through content. I'll help for free though because that, to me, is what being part of a community is about. I make my gil other ways.

To answer your question, I honestly think so as well...because those people who were carried through hardly learn the mechanics of the fight, and dont progress enough to really be very beneficial to later groups. But I guess that's fine because they can just buy their way through that content as well.

[Kallera]

I think it doesn't help. combined with rmt tells and the pressure to get in on learning pts before they vanish in "no 100sol"fests, it helps convey the temptation to look to that rmt for their problems. Like it or not, parties like that contribute to the demand that people need to pay to win.

Eventually I'm sure clear selling will try to take their show outside of the pf as well. In what ways I can only speculate.

[Devils_Lawyer]

Dosnt hurt the community imo.

Every encounter is different, just cause you can 1 shot garuda EX anyday of the week dosnt mean you can beat titan EX.

All you do really is learning a boss mechanic and when you know what comes next and how to avoid/deal with it then it dosnt matter if you payed yourself thru earlier stuff or not.

[Kitano123]

I'm looking for opinions here. My server currently has anywhere between 1-6 selling groups in party finder all day long (depending on peak hours or not).

As players try to get their clears or farms going, many players are skilled but just can't get other skilled players to join them so it ends up being a lot of wiping before you can see some success.

The question to be asked is: Would people who sell the runs bother to join and help out other skilled people in clears or farms? I personally have not seen the known run sellers in anything I have done. There is no profit to be made by helping others, is that the mentality of run sellers? I cannot say for sure.

This is why I'm leaving this open for opinions and other views. Perhaps supporting run selling only makes things worse for you and everyone else, perhaps it doesn't matter at all.

I've sold runs and I help people for free, I know others outside my group who do the same. I doubt people who would be unwilling to help others because of sale runs would help people for free if they couldnt sell them.

Alot of the people who buy runs do it for the guaranteed loot not the clear. People often buy multiple runs.

If you want to find skilled players to help you, join a decent FC or LS. If you dislike sale runs, why not start your own group to help new players through content for free?

[Spy]

Do you realize how many times doing coil or something, when discussing mechanics, we've said things like "It's a lot like Twintania's divebombs/twisters" or "This is very similar to Titan's plumes" No. I think it helps a LOT to learn mechanics from previous fights.

[Mercutial]

Thank you Spy. Meant to make that point, as well.

[Purrfectstorm]

No because sell groups typically aren't selling carries through progression content (at least from what I've seen).
No because all fights are different.
No because some people don't care about doing endgame but still want their clears (i.e. they won't come back to the content right off).
No because sometimes you can be capable but unable to find a good group.

Those are just a few reasons. That being said, I bought Titan EX and T5 wins ages ago and have regretted it ever since. Yes it was hard finding groups and I don't think there is anything morally wrong with buying carries. However, it didn't really help me meet my goals because I don't want to get a clear and forget about the fight; I want to really know what I'm doing and I want to have the social connections to go back and farm or help others if I want to. I don't find lying in the dirt while others beat the fight for me much fun. Although in both paid groups, I perfectly executed mechanics and never died.

Anyway, I've since learned those fights really well and helped multiple people clear them. The gil I spent on a group was just a waste. It hurt me but I think the rest of the community is fine

[Kitano123]

Do you realize how many times doing coil or something, when discussing mechanics, we've said things like "It's a lot like Twintania's divebombs/twisters" or "This is very similar to Titan's plumes" No. I think it helps a LOT to learn mechanics from previous fights.

That has nothing to do with sale runs though. You dont have to pay to be carried, especially in older fights.