Fan Census: This is embarrassing

[Saseal]

Yeah love the posts blaming this on na/EU not having the will or motivation to do coil, instead of the sheer wall of elitism and attitude nastiness that separates most players from even doing coil.

^ This.
I wouldn't mind attempting more coil if people weren't so stupid about their attitudes. FC too small and I'm on at different times (or not at all) too often - IE, I'm on often, but the timing fluctuates to have a static. It's the ragers and immature that keep me from bothering. I'd like to complete it, I'd like to be challenged with harder content, but not at the expense of verbal abuse. That kind of environment is not conducive to wanting to do an optional task - and it just makes you perform worse when you're nervous about backlash.
Until the FC grows enough, where we can be our own flexible static, I'm probably not going to continue through the rest of the coils. I'm not playing to have nerd rage blasted in my ear.

I also don't see whats so embarrassing. Different cultures have different priorities.

[Lori]

The average download speed in Japan is 71.97 Mbps
The average download speed in the USA is 35.16 Mbps
The average download speed in Canada is 29.83

The truth is that it's not about skill, or willingness to do said content. It's all about infrastructure. The desire to raid and ability to learn will always be trumped by the fact that NA consists of First-world nations with Third-world internet access. Latency in this game is EVERYTHING when dealing with 1-shot mechanics. Not to mention many ISPs here still think 3-5 Mbps is "good enough" and don't even offer anything faster.

I hope you're not serious with this response, because this isn't the problem for the majority of players. They're either just bad, or don't care for it

[Hiruke]

I think at least part of the problem has to do with the fact that to do Coil when it's current, you need to make a static. Not everyone wants to commit to playing with 7 other people multiple days a week for hours on end. Yoshida seems to think MMOs have been trending toward "more hardcore" lately, but I don't really see it. If anything, it's always been trending toward more casual, and STARTED OUT as more hardcore. I'm sure in Japan making a static is less challenging since most everyone will be on roughly the same schedule, rather than people being from different time zones and whatnot.

Here's what would make Coil more likely to get done pretty much ever:

- Should have been set up similar to how Alexander is being set up: with a Normal mode and a Hard mode, so the Normal mode could always be easier, could be made even easier if need be, so everyone can feel good about completing the story, and everyone who wanted a "real challenge" could step up to the plate on the Hard mode
- No lockout of any kind
-- Loot lockout is ridiculous. Hardcore groups already sell wins long before any of the restrictions are lifted, so clearly the loot lockout isn't preventing them from gearing up absurdly quickly. Really it just punishes people who do Coil less often and/or are worse at it, so it takes them so long to get anything it's irrelevant by the time they do. Not exactly a win/win.
-- Being limited to one clear per Turn each week is just as stupid. Once you're ready to do Coil, it's basically the only content in the game, so if you're super good at it, you've got an hour's worth of content each week. Oh boy! It would make much more sense to spam Turn 1 of any given Coil and gear up from that then move to the next one, etc. You know, real tiering, as opposed to the just beat all 4 Turns every week because of course!
-- Having to do the Turns in order is again ridiculous. What if you already have everything from Turn 1? Too bad, keep doing it! I think you should be forced to do each Turn to unlock the next, but then they should remain unlocked. Like, I don't like that when Coil goes into DF you can ignore the first 3/4 Turns and just beat the last one. You should have to do all of them. But not, you know, every week.
-- Seriously, if less than less than 10% of people are even clearing FCOB globally before it goes into solo DF, certainly the overwhelming majority of your subs aren't ever going to fall off because they get Coil gear "too quickly". You should be doing more to make it easier for people to jump into this stuff (not by making it easier - though there should be an easier and a more difficult option, like they are already doing going forward), by making it not as difficult for people logistically. Being forced to form statics to do this content at all is a huge hurdle for a lot of people, and even the people who suffer through it will regularly tell you about how this or that static blew up. It's just a lot of extra unnecessary stress, and devalues the concept of a Free Company. If you could get any random set of people from your FC and do FCOB at any given time without worrying about restrictions, I feel a lot more people would do it, do it more often, and clear it. But instead you have to worry about maintaining a relationship with a specific 7 other people that you may or may not like, possibly with disparate play times, and hope everyone keeps playing, doesn't start sucking, lose interest, start some drama, etc.
- Put it into DF right from the get. For the PF train, unless you are doing it from week 1, it's pretty unlikely you are ever going to get into any "learning" groups, so unless you formed a static, you're just not doing Coil this season. Seriously, it's so difficult for the average player to get face time on Coil before it's irrelevant just from a social perspective, forget how difficult it is or isn't.
- Pie in the sky would be more relevant content to do that's relevant at the same time, like if there was good gear from EX primals, good gear from Alexander, good gear from other content that honestly just doesn't exist so far, good gear from crafting (with materials coming from some kind of battle content similar to BCNM from FFXI or whatever) all at the current max iLVL (crafting could be slightly below thanks to materia), rather than having an hour's worth of content be the only thing you ever do ever each week.

Your average player can't even beat ANY of the Extreme primals, but we're worried the entire user base is going to slam through Coil so quick and completely gear out to the point where there's nothing left to do in the game? REALLY? AHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.

Not a chance, Yoshida. Not a chance.

[MageBlack]

If content is tedious to go through, most people will bend over backwards not to do it again after clearing it once, or at all. As it was said, no sense expanding on content only a small handful of players get interested in...

Agreed, and that goes to say we arent looking to get rid of the Coil or Alexander (HM) but it would be mostly wasted resources to add more of this type of content in. There are also the EX primals that I dont think were included in these numbers. I would be willing to bet those numbers are higher. Maybe we/they should look at those numbers too and see what the difference is? Why does one succeed and nt the other? Can we replicate it and expand on it? Make it better?

Just need to ask better questions.

[MicahZerrshia]

it really points out how small the vocal minority of "hardcore" players there actually are.

Hardcore players are too busy actually playing the game to come to the forums and complain about content.

If the ppl who post 10 comments per thread per day complaining about content would actually put that same effort into completing said content it would be better for the community at large. I always feel community forums are the most detrimental things to games because of the extremely vocal minority who complain more than actually play. When ppl utter the word "elitest" or "to hard" they generally loose all credibility to me. But I am an old school gamer who grew up on games that were actually difficult, much unlike many of the ones today.

Like I said in my above post, it isn't the content, its been the community making things difficult for some people, such as myself.

[Eye_Gore]

I always feel community forums are the most detrimental things to games because of the extremely vocal minority who complain more than actually play.

But what if you play and are on the forum at the same time? Maybe throw a post or two up while waiting on a duty, FATE, or a hunt.

[Parodine]

Like I said in my above post, it isn't the content, its been the community making things difficult for some people, such as myself.

She's not judging hardcore by people complaining on the forum, she's judging it by the % who have FCOB wins. Which is still a minute percentage in the grand scheme of the game.

[MageBlack]

-snip-
Like I said in my above post, it isn't the content, its been the community making things difficult for some people, such as myself.

And I completely agree with you. Content is not the problem, its the community. I'm old skool as well, been playing games the better part of 32 years. I used the term "Hardcore" in quotation marks cause it is a subjective term that really needs an agreed upon definition before any meaningful conversation can be had. As for elitist, well that is a mind set that players get in to where they basically lack patience for anyone who isnt at their level of performance. I honestly couldnt even tell you if I think Coil is hard or not because I havent even had a chance to do it, not for lack of trying.

[Elim]

Interesting information. I honestly thought the % was a lot higher on gilgamesh because everywhere I look I see people that have cleared coil, and 99% of the people on my friends list have cleared it as well. I have a lot of people on my friends list, many who I don't remember speaking to.

My static plans on helping some people through T13 for free... I think we are pretty nice people.

Not sure how this information is shameful though. It's just a game. And as aforementioned, we have higher populations.

[Anneliese]

You are the 2%.

I have nothing against hardcore content but 2% of the population that is completing the content will hardly hurt subs. I love this thread cause it really points out how small the vocal minority of "hardcore" players there actually are. Do you think that even doubling this content will raise that number? Doubt it. Even if it did, that 2 or 4% will still complain its not hard enough and there's nothing to do.

Also This.
V V

Nope. 2-3% is the percentage of people that completed final coil. Like I said, that percentage does not reflect the proportion of the population that are currently progressing or trying. Furthermore, that percentage includes stuff like inactive accounts and the seemingly endless amounts of RMT accounts added to each server consistently. I'm not saying that people interested in raid are the majority but you are severely downplaying it.

Also, that 2-3% becomes 12-15% on JP servers: a significant portion of SE's target market.

Let's say for every 1 person that's cleared all of final coil, there's maybe 5 that are interested in raid and trying to progress. That number could be higher or lower but I'll just go with that arbitrary number for the sake of making a point. That makes 10-15% of the population that are working on coil. Add the 2-3% to that and you can have up to 18%: a number that probably more realistically portrays how many people are actually working on raid content. And that number is probably significantly higher on JP servers too.