More complexity to dungeons

[LunnaRavenheart]

Hello devs and players,

I would like to see and have more complexity and layers in dungeons not just 1 corridor with 3 bosses.
I feel like every 3 months there are only 3 reskinned not challenging very simple dungeons.
I know that many people dont want to spend much time in 1 run or do something harder so I would keep 1 of them. Instead of other 2 I want something like BRD, more complex more optional.

Also I would like to see some medium difficulty endgame content like Kahrazan was in WoW. Big house/castle/cave with 10-12bosses 6-7 optional, 4-5mandatory with puzzles like opera event, chess event or something interesting.

Could also vet players get some real raid like SSC, AQ, SWP, NAXX? I mean content for 8 players but more in scale.
Because it seems there is not end game like that. We have Coil but it mostly feel like Magtheridon or Gruul. Its like few pack of trash and boss. Could we get something big scaled in size of coearthas map with 10 bosses in area? If WoW can get 5 big sized raids per 2 years why we dont have any?

Could vet mmo players get some love from developers?

Thank you

[JimboTCB]

People always ask for more complicated dungeons, then they clear them once and start complaining that all the trash is boring and slows them down when they just want to whack at the shiny loot pinatas once a week.

[VargasVermillion]

^ which sucks but that's how it is unfortunately. I still want more complex dungeons though, akin to heroics in WoW.

[Squaak]

I would welcome higher difficulty 4-man dungeons.
Raid content that works more like an 8-man dungeon with more than 3 major encounters.
More complex trials that plays out differently than the ones we've got.

Steps of Faith was a step in the right direction. It's not raid-difficulty, and pushes people towards practising to get better in a group setting. It also gives room to recover from mistakes. Completely eliminating wipe = fail + restart. Placing this level of difficulty and higher as stepping-stones to unlock raid content could help prepare people, and maybe interest them more in improving/progressing, as they would feel like they achieve something when beating individual encounters. Maybe?

Either way. I appreciate everything new that the devs put together and give to us in the form of raids, trials and dungeons.

[MXMoondoggie]

The problem with SoF is that it's incredibly boring to repeat to the point people dread getting it in the trial queue. Even the Ultros fight was boring after the first time. That's the main misgiving i have about over complicated dungeons that make you jump through hoops. More interesting boss mechanics is fine but when you need to do a bunch of dumb stuff just to get there i roll my eyes. Wonderholme in Tera Online was a good example of this it's kind of fun the first time but then it just becomes a chore to go through all the motions. I prefer consistency over a cheap thrill one time that bores me each time after.

No stupid puzzles, no jumping platforms to get to switches to open doors, no BS slow sneaking around past mobs. Just none of it. Let me farm my stuff for the week and move on.

[JimboTCB]

Indeed. Steps is interesting, different and satisfyingly challenging, and people took an almost instant dislike to it. Now they do it once for the main scenario and complain like hell if it comes up in trials roulette, because all they want to do is faceroll through content they're hilariously overgeared for.

[MXMoondoggie]

It's not really about wanting to faceroll it's about not wanting some slow chugging instance that you need to do a bunch of really dumb things to beat. Doing SoF more than once is boring not because it's hard. It isn't. It's just boring a boss slowly walks along and adds endlessly spawn. If you are not doing cannons, snares or the tower it's boring. Even if you are the novelty quickly wears off.

[ShaneDawn]

They really should offer difficult/challengive 4-man dungeons as well. Currently they all follow the same pattern and the only challengive content in the game are the coils. It wouldn't need to be super hard, but at this point any attempts to break the 3x trash 3x boss ez mold is a step in the right direction.

These dungeons should be completely optional, as otherwise people would just cry about progression locks (although I think even story should offer a marginal degree of mechanics to progressively teach people how to play the game).

But, as said. Any content that is remotely hard will get either 'zomgs nerf this' (look; SoF, ppl asking for Landslide to not drop people on TEX) or brushed off as irrelevant if it offers sub-par rewards. Even the coils are majorly overlooked by the casual playerbase of the game.

[Tuathaa]

If WoW can get 5 big sized raids per 2 years why we dont have any

Been awhile since you played wow then. Raiding has become an absolute joke and it makes fcob look overtly complicated.

[Zaft]

If WoW can get 5 big sized raids per 2 years why we dont have any?

Oh man, coming from The Burning Crusade are we? Cause that's the last time we actually had 5 full-sized raids.

Classic (5): MC, BWL, AQ20, AQ40, Naxx
TBC: (6): Kara, SSC, TK, MH, BT, Sunwell (aka the best raid)
Wrath (2): Ulduar, ICC
Cata (4): BWD, BT, FL, DS
Mists (4): MSV, HoF, ToT, SoO
WoD (3, not done yet): HM, BRF, HFC

But I do agree we need better raids. Right now, every raid is just Onyxia. Kill 2 packs of trash (or none even), kill boss, repeat. No exploration, no optional content, no challenging achievements. Boooo.

Been awhile since you played wow then. Raiding has become an absolute joke and it makes fcob look overtly complicated.

Are you saying that as somebody who raids Mythic tier content, or somebody who completed LFR, maybe normal, and then claimed it was too easy? Because WoW's top-tier raid difficulty is far, far higher than anything we have on FFXIV at the moment.