EX Dungeons in Heavensward please?

[PlumpyMcduff]

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May we please see OPTIONAL EX-Difficulty Dungeons in Heavensward? "Wandering Minstrel: Sunken Temple of Qarn," etc.

Refer to: WoW Heroic Dungeons.

You've confirmed Normal & Hard Difficulty Raids but not harder dungeons. One of the games biggest critiques is that dungeons (even hard-mode 50 dungeons) are pathetically easy.


No, the pre-nerf Pharos example isn't a good counter-argument because it's primary issue was difficulty:reward ratio as compared to the dungeons it was released alongside of. And the complainers made up only half (for illustration) of arguers for/against Pharos' nerfing... many, many people wanted the difficulty retained but reward become appropriately proportionate. Many people, in fact, have argued for generally harder dungeons all around. And not merely statistical difficulty, but primarily mechanical difficulty.

Not everybody wants more difficulty options, but from researching, a sufficient plenty do enough to justify EX-Difficulty Dungeon implementation.


Normal-Difficulty Raids are an answer to providing more "Midcore Content" to the game.

EX-Dungeons would serve the same, exact purpose.

If you think it best, I think it'd be Ok if these were premade-only (no DF, at least for a long while, if at all).

EX-24 Man's to supplement this request would be HUGE too (same as before, Ok if no DF IMHO).

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[IceSpear]

We want harder dungeons! When do we want em? Now! XD No really harder dungeons would be nice maybe something that requires a little more strategy on the boss battles rather than some gimmick have phases in the boss battles like Brayflox HM? Multiple paths to the boss? You could even have "easy routes" and "hard routes" with the harder one dropping better loot than the easy.

[Callinon]

I thought something was mentioned about the idea of "Savage" dungeons in either one of the interviews or live letters recently.

[seekified]

I definitely agree with this. If trash pulls in dungeons could be more like pre-nerf T10 and T11, they'd be so much more interesting and rewarding to do even when the content is somewhat outgeared. Thing is though, the rewards in terms of loot need to be there as well - I find little incentive to spend valuable playtime on Savage Coil because it doesn't give me anything more than bragging rights and an interesting fight. Those are good to have, but loot is why we play. Raise the currency reward slighly and have each boss drop one more piece of loot and I'm there.

That said, I do think that instead of nerfing raid content they should introduce an Easy Mode - again allowing people who aren't used to endgame raiding to progress, but with a lower currency reward per run and only one loot reward instead of two.

[Spoekes]

More content is always good but

1) what loot or other reward do you expect there?
2) gear progression has been like: farm dungeons -> do the raid/ex-primal stuff
3) what gear should be required for those? If you need top level gear for those, the only reward you can give are titles and such
4) will there be enough players doing this, considering the above things about loot and reward vs. gear you need? How many players do savage right now?
5) I'd rather see more full party content.
6) What you want could also be achieved by tightening the iLevel synch on current and future dungeons.

[JonBigwood]

Graduating the difficulty is not an easy task. Usually new dungeons are a bit difficult (with random parties) for some time, and when most people know them well and are a bit more geared they become a bit too easy. As soon as a place is a bit more difficult you start to find people who quit the place just at the start in DF. It happened in Pharos Sirius but also in Tam Tara HM when it was a new place.

The problem from my point of view are the rewards. If these harder dungeons give better gear rewards, then they become the way to go or the fastest way to gear up and either everybody would do them (they become sort of obligatory) or there would be a widening gap between people who can do them and people who can't. It might be they give more tomestones of the capped variety so you would just cap earlier on the week, but now you already cap quite easily so people might complain they do not have enough things to do.

Of course more content is always welcome but resources are limited so usually there must be choices.

Ilvl sync may be a way to make content not so easy. If we (optionally) get synced to the entry ilvl or near it, things would change a lot. I don't think people would sync to entry ilevel every time when farming tomestones, but maybe from time to time with friends just for fun.

[seekified]

In terms of difficulty, Pharos may have been the closest thing to what I want. Before it was nerfed to hell, that is. The problem with Pharos was never how challenging it was, it was that other, far easier dungeons gave the same rewards.

[Caraway]

I'm all for more varied, difficult options. And while I do like the idea of using item sync to say, bring down the player's power to near-to/the minimum item level required, it doesn't add mechanical difficult. Just tightens what's already there.

As for rewards, perhaps glamour options. Don't provide increase iLVL but perhaps side-grades or different appearances to the existing normal mode's gear.

[Spoekes]

I'm all for more varied, difficult options. And while I do like the idea of using item sync to say, bring down the player's power to near-to/the minimum item level required, it doesn't add mechanical difficult. Just tightens what's already there.

As for rewards, perhaps glamour options. Don't provide increase iLVL but perhaps side-grades or different appearances to the existing normal mode's gear.

For the mechanical stuff please consider that many mechanics are just very watered down or even completely skipped over by dps burn or hp pools to even be noticed as mechanics if you don't know they are actually happening with actual overgearing.

[Kemiko]

I wouldn't mind optional Extreme Dungeons. I wouldn't mind if there were 8-man dungeons. I wouldn't even mind harder dungeons (thought outside of ilv restrictions or mechanical gimmicks, I don't know how you'll up the difficulty. And once a mechanic is known and people have done it enough, the difficulty of the dungeon/trial/raid drops considerably).

What I do mind is a 24-man anything that cannot be DF'd. If anything that should never happen, it should be that.