The final part of ARR story doesn't make enough sense.

[Alise]

Despite I really like how you can see a long running cut-scene deserved to be an ending of the game. The scene was kind of forced with intention "just want to have a bad ending, to motivate players to solve problem in next chapter" feeling into it.

First of all, it doesn't make sense at all. We, warrior of light, is the strongest person out there acting nothing in front of those events. We destroyed Allagan emperior, Cloud of darkness, Ascians, Empire best man, primals, and all. None of brass-blade or any crystal brave solder will ever win any of those no matter how many people they gang up upon. And we simply become a helpless person out there suddenly, doing nothing, and let all the NPC show their turn. We just love to being captured, and uncaptured by them somehow?

What about Echo power?
Do we forget how we always solve all the detective problem using Echo before? (If you have played 1.0, or play through many story quests, then you know how good a detective our character always have been!) This story can be unwinded so easily by simple capture those enemies head right on the spot there and then use echo on them!

Solution to this?
Well, we have all the important/strong NPC over there right on the spot. We have Raubian on our side also! Combine the strength if Warrior of Light is willing to do anything, we simply have enough resourced to capture everybody on the spot and use echo on them. Our name will be cleaned very quickly. I cannot see how we can't win the fight despite being out numbers. I believe that in the next fight, we will have to fight through a lot more solder in order to reach the head of the enemy as a boss of a dungeon anyway, and we will be able to manage that. But the situation now which is easier, we just run away helplessly....

All in all, I understand how they want to force an event where we need to go to Ishgard, and that they think it is better to have a bad ending, so that players would have more motivation to play again. However, the story itself doesn't really justify enough for me. If they want us to really lose so much like that, they should have a few empire captain equal strength to White Raven or Black Wolf on the spot to kick us out..

[Tinibou]

Except that we don't have the power of Echo anymore since it has been removed by the dragon Midgarsomr at the end of the Keeper of the Lake quest / instance...

[FJerome]

Except that we don't have the power of Echo anymore since it has been removed by the dragon Midgarsomr at the end of the Keeper of the Lake quest / instance...

We got the Blessing removed, the one that protects us from the Ascians. The Echo still seems to be in-play (which brings up the question of if that comes from Hydaelyn at all but that's a topic for another thread).

While I'm willing to buy that we didn't fight back because we are cool-headed thinkers who consider long-term implications to rash actions (which fits my character, at least) in future I would like the bad-guys to show up with our retainers held hostage or somesuch, just to give all characters a better set of motivations.

[RobinRethiel]

Yes, it is a big problem and could have been done with the same result, wiht just some differences, so it makes more sense.

1. Let Kan and Merl be outside. Chaos starts and they could go to their city states without looking like ****, who just let their main ally being mutilated by a mercenary in front of their eyes.
2. Let Raubahn be alone with the Lalas (and their guards) -> also no witnesses, there were far too many on the banquet, when the assassination of the Sultana was announced, no way to hide this.
3. Just blame the assassination on the Scions - including the WoL - in total. The Sultana was poisoned. It's absolutely dumb to blame this on the person inside the room, no stranger to the house would poison someone like that. It would have made much more sense, if they had put the poison vial into the luggage of one of the Scions and find it there after the assassination. This would have raised much more eyebrows. The whole vial scene made not much sense. We could have talked to soo many people about it on the way home, in Uldah, could have asked Alchemists and so on, so many people who then could later attest, that we didn't have a vial with poison, but this empty one and asked a lot of questions about it, something an assassin wouldn't do.
4. Give the Scions a real reason for their sacrifice. It's okay, that we do not slaughter half of the Brass Blades (even though it seems quite possible, since two alone can fight dozens of them, so what would the whole group be able to do, including powerful heals from the WoL and Ysh? But they chatted far too long, wasting time and I really don't see any reason, why those Brass Blades and Crystal Braves must be delayed. I don't see how they could be faster than us.

The outcome could be exactly the same, there are just some little points, which make it feel so odd and that's quite sad.

Would also maybe be better, if we just get a disguise spell, when we enter the cities. That everyone loves us (because well, they can't just kick the players out of the cities or Uldah, this would really hurt the gameplay) does not make much sense. This would mean, that the coup totally failed and that we really got no reason to flee.

And yes:
Personally I would just have helped Raubahn (Scions were there, all got their weapons and if we really did not have ours when with the Sultana, I'm sure that one of them would have it, who else?) to kill the traitors and Lolo. Who would know? We were alone in there, would just blame the assassination on them (which is the truth anyway, hell, we even HEARED the confession) and well, they resisted and tried to kill Raubahn, Kan and Merl, too, so it was just self defense. Don't think, that the three leaders or Scions would have had so much probs with that...
Don't think, that Mr. Traitor and Lolo - no matter what they got on their side - would have much of a chance against the Flame's general, the WoL and the Scions (even if Merl and Kan would not help or be elsewhere).

Now everything is far more f**** up.

Except that we don't have the power of Echo anymore since it has been removed by the dragon Midgarsomr at the end of the Keeper of the Lake quest / instance...

We don't have the blessing of light, but we still got the echo. But it is not needed for this case. We got the confession of the assassin. And well, who would the people believe? Mr. Oligarch (if we let him live) or the Flame's general and the Scions, who are known to have saved the life of the citizens of all three city states more than one time?

EDIT:
@ Poison Vial
If there are really such strict rules about weapons, when you meet the Sultana, the guards would have searched us - and would have seen the empty vial. Since it was all for the Sultana's safety, they would for sure not allow people to get in there with some odd liquids in their pocket.

[Cilia]

While it's true that from a gameplay standpoint we have the power to fell Primals and such, the main thing that lets us do this so easily is the Echo - because we're immune to tempering, we're able to take them on with far less danger than is normally associated. There's nothing saying other people don't have the martial prowess to match us, though. In fact the Company of Heroes felled both Titan and Leviathan in the past, albeit with heavy losses.

As for detective work and proving your innocence, it'd be a pretty trivial thing to do if you had a fair trial. Emphasis on fair. The Ul'dahn government is so corrupt now that reality has become a commodity. Lolorito wants you out of the picture, so even if you were afforded a trial there's no way you'd be declared innocent.

[Velhart]

I know it is kind of a stretch, but all the impossible feats we accomplished like taking on primals, the empire, and other major feats were done with a party, not just you alone. Even in cutscenes, the NPC's mention you need to gather your companions and go in and fight.

Look at previous Final Fantasy's. FFX for example, you have taken down major sinspawns and other major enemies, but you are still running from Seymour's guards to escape. I know it seems ridiculous that our character seems like he is against normal soldiers, but in a story perspective, being surrounded by a bunch of swords to your neck and going guns blazing instead of being handcuffed would make you look more guilty.

Not saying this was the most well written thing ever, but sometimes this is just a thing. This logic has been done so many times in various games.

[Yoohre_WildRiver]

fighting back would only serve t o prove we killed sultana. also there seems to be bigger players behind the monetarists, if you watch the cs after the credits ( very important cutscenes btw !!) you could see lolorito was not very happy when the maiden reported to him ... as in he had no choice but to be part of the whole mess.

[RobinRethiel]

fighting back would only serve t o prove we killed sultana. also there seems to be bigger players behind the monetarists, if you watch the cs after the credits ( very important cutscenes btw !!) you could see lolorito was not very happy when the maiden reported to him ... as in he had no choice but to be part of the whole mess.

No, fleeing proves this.

[Velhart]

No, fleeing proves this.

Killing people would make you look more guilty. You might look guilty fleeing, but doing so at least gives you opportunity to prove your innocence. You accomplish nothing taking down the syndicate on the spot. Look at Raubahn for example. Well respected and trusted leader, all that completely destroyed fighting back and now sits in a cell with only one arm.

[RobinRethiel]

Killing people would make you look more guilty. You might look guilty fleeing, but doing so at least gives you opportunity to prove your innocence. You accomplish nothing taking down the syndicate on the spot. Look at Raubahn for example. Well respected and trusted leader, all that completely destroyed fighting back and now sits in a cell with only one arm.

Never said we should slaughter the Brass, for what? Why do people always think of slaughtering the Brass? I dont't get it.
We should have slaughtered Ilberd and Lolo. Who should accuse after after they are gone? Raubahn?

But even without: Just staying for a trial. Really would like to see, how Lolo tries to convince the people, that we have killed the Sultana so he can take over Uldah.

Helping Raubahn would further help TelAdel/Lolorito's case against the WoL and the Scions in witchcraft (likely they mean the Echo) and Nanamo's death. There was just no way to win in this situation.

They would be dead. How would this help them?