"I Was Out of That!" (Some Life Lessons)

[Massterchef]

... You do realize there is an actual delay between client and actually moving?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0bMV6BVJSU

Go to 1:00

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5g4TM1fkCg

But she was out of that!

It's funny how many people will link those exact 'year old' videos knowing that the positional server response has improved by a huge margin since then.

Those aren't proof, it's about time to stop linking them.

[BreathlessTao]

I hate this mind set. I often wonder how did the first group doing Titan ever clear it without watching a video, and did they make a video while they did it so the second group could watch and so on?

I often see people in Titan say they are new and the most I usually see anyone say is "dodge stuff" while the MT or someone else is already pulling.

Moreover: this whole "watch a video" attitude is just mind-boggling. Makes me think that people like that literally can't imagine a world without YouTube and Twitch and MrHappy and whoever else - that they can't imagine that videogames existed before the internet, and people were able to play and complete them. It was not that long ago, y'know?

How about turning the table instead? If you know you don't have the time/patience for any random screw-up, just don't use the DF. Regardless of the lack of official policy about it, everyone knows that absolutely anything can happen in a DF run. And knowing that, it's just stupid to complain about "noobs who can't even watch a video".
On a personal sidenote: I wholly resent the idea of being forced to watch 3rd party videos, when we're denied the opportunity to enjoy the game's own ones, at their designated places (yes, I mostly mean Castrum Meridianum and Praetorium, the kicks, the lockouts, the fighting and namecalling, everything that's been discussed to no end on here).

I just gave another try to Titan Ex myself, via DF, and - the group was not doing good. The question "everyone know what to do?" was asked at the beginning, but by the time anyone could even have started to type the answer, Titan was pulled. One of the tanks seemed obviously new to the duty, so after the first wipe, the other told him to "switch at 3" - and when we wiped a 2nd time, he went "i'm sorry warr but we have to kick you, you came at 2 stacks and that confused me". Vote dismiss initiated, and the poor guy was kicked. "That should teach him! " and "he was so clueless lol :P" ensued. And so I left too, because I voted no, because I didn't agree with it - the tank might have been clueless, but it was not only his fault we failed, some just couldn't dodge, and most people didn't even try stacking up, they were spread out like butter on a piece of toast. Anyhow, on one hand, yes, kicking someone who's obviously new and want to try, will really help them know the fight indeed, congrats on that logic. On the other hand, if you really are so impatient, like I said, just don't do DF. You're not forced to. If you want 15min speedruns to get your drop or cap your tomes, surely you have a group of people with the same goals whom you can do it with - faster, simpler, you don't get upset yourself and you don't aggravate others either.

[AreeyaJaidee]

If you can't be bothered to at least watch a short video or read about the fight, sure, w/e.

But if you don't even have the decency to announce to the group that you are new and have no idea what to do so people can give you a quick run down, you are going to cause everyone in the group head aches or be a complete carry.

Exactly. Somehow new players in content think someone typing a text wall for them before each pull is better learning method than watching a video where someone talks you through the whole fight step by step with pictures and all.

Some ppl are just silly.

And to top it off they get indignant and rude when you give them sound advice. Its like the OP said, ppl have a inner defensive voice too, they don't want to be real with themselves and think maybe their method of learning is wrong and maybe their at fault instead of the ppl telling them how to get good.

Silly silly

[micropanther7]

I'd rather not treat people as objects, new or old.

I can understand this for people lying their way into of groups, but its no reason to hate new people with a broad brush. The df is going to be what it is, the culture already set.

I'm more a written article fan anyway.

It does make one wonder if some players treat people like NPCs... or they want a perfectly programmed robot lol, even if you've watched vids, run something hundreds of times and did well, sometimes things just happen (cat jumping on keyboard, accidentally knocking a cup of tea over, real life stuff that sometimes you have no control over whatsoever, etc).

[Purrfectstorm]

Moreover: this whole "watch a video" attitude is just mind-boggling. Makes me think that people like that literally can't imagine a world without YouTube and Twitch and MrHappy and whoever else - that they can't imagine that videogames existed before the internet, and people were able to play and complete them. It was not that long ago, y'know?

Again, I'll reiterate that it's not a "watch a video" attitude, it's a "use whatever tools are available" attitude. I'm 35 years old. I don't have to imagine a world without YouTube, I actually lived in it, you know? But I'm not averse to using new tools as they become available.

Also, you can't compare MMOs to other video games (or even modern MMOs to MMOs of the past). Fights are heavily mechanics driven and require the knowledge of said mechanics to clear AND you're playing with other people. What you do affects them too.

I agree that players can prepare (or not prepare) however they want for DF but there is an incentive for watching a video first. You will perform better and your group will be less likely to disband. If either of these things seems undesirable to you, then please, by all means, continue to be stubborn about not watching a video.

[Altijacek]

Being prepared is one thing, but having to watch a video is so fricking stupid I hate that. If a party finder demand I watch the video, fine it's his party. But man nothing feels more epic than going in blind; that said, I'm not going to be a hindrance to a random group of players i just met, so I'll run new content or content I haven't done with friends. But damn it people need to stop saying that watching a video is mandatory. Videos are so stupid, since the team make ups are different, strategies are different, etc. the only thing videos are OKAY for is explaining the fight mechanics, but not necessarily how to deal with them. If you want to watch a video, fine. But if you want to experience an epic fight and solve the puzzle on your own, don't feel like you NEED to watch the video. Just run with friends or make a blind PF.

[Izularia]

Even if you have watched a video, you still need to get a feeling for content that is new to you. Of course, you are more prepared, but as a first timer, it is unlikely that you won't make any mistakes.
It's very clear who is new and who is not, at least most of the time.

[LineageRazor]

Nothing feels as epic as going in blind, I agree - but it really only works if everyone else with you is ALREADY going in blind, or is aware and tolerant of the fact that you're going in blind. If it is difficult content, it will not take long for the group to figure out that you have no idea what you're doing. Best case scenario, they explain to you what is going on and what you need to do. Worst case? Verbal abuse and a kick.

In the first case - well, there goes your blindness. You've just had the fight explained to you. You're now in the same position as you would be if you watched the video, except you've wasted a bit of time for seven other people.

In the second case, you get to keep your blindness, but you're out a party, and possibly even blacklisted.

If content is more than a week old, it's best to either find like-minded folks who are willing to explore content blind with you (party finder works better than you think for this, especially early in the content's life; Free Company is another option, depending on how friendly the folks in your FC are), or bite the bullet and watch a vid so you at least know what's coming. There's no replacement for actual experience, this is true, but there's still a world of difference between, "Ah, so that's how that mechanic works," and "What the crap was that?"

[Skivvy]

Being prepared is one thing, but having to watch a video is so fricking stupid I hate that. If a party finder demand I watch the video, fine it's his party. But man nothing feels more epic than going in blind; that said, I'm not going to be a hindrance to a random group of players i just met, so I'll run new content or content I haven't done with friends. But damn it people need to stop saying that watching a video is mandatory. Videos are so stupid, since the team make ups are different, strategies are different, etc. the only thing videos are OKAY for is explaining the fight mechanics, but not necessarily how to deal with them. If you want to watch a video, fine. But if you want to experience an epic fight and solve the puzzle on your own, don't feel like you NEED to watch the video. Just run with friends or make a blind PF.

The most fun I've had in a dungeon was when I ran Brayflox HM completely blind with some friends (who had already been before), and they gave me no hints at all. That last boss had me laughing so hard after I wiped our poor little group. It's really unfortunate to see people demanding that you watch a video before attempting any content through the duty finder. Party finder should be allowed to be as picky as they want, but don't take those expectations to DF.

I will say though, if you are new to content, speak up. That's what dooms groups a lot of the time. I think a good chunk of people are afraid to speak up as they think they'll either get a tongue lashing or get kicked.

[Raeletta]

Exactly. Somehow new players in content think someone typing a text wall for them before each pull is better learning method than watching a video where someone talks you through the whole fight step by step with pictures and all.

Some ppl are just silly.

And to top it off they get indignant and rude when you give them sound advice. Its like the OP said, ppl have a inner defensive voice too, they don't want to be real with themselves and think maybe their method of learning is wrong and maybe their at fault instead of the ppl telling them how to get good.

Silly silly

Go and research learning styles, people are very different in how they learn best. Videos don't help everyone, aside the fact that they completely ruin the fun in things being -surprising and new-

Videos teach me nothing, and the few times I ever watched them, made things worse as the way I mange my camera is different, my preferred position any time it's not determined by a mechanic is different... (Boss the right, I move towards the camera for flank skills). I'm far from the only person to be like this.

Honestly, at times I wish I could rote memorise entire boss fights, but its simply not a thing I can do, it's largely reflex from memory.

Practical is the way I learn, usually quickly. Text guides help a little, but only so much. (I'll usually remember skillnames and a general idea of what they do etc.)