Abandoning a Duty? Just Stahp...

[Zaft]

No. If the fight relies too much on overlapping mechanics and RNG factors to confuse and frustrate non-elitist players, it is overtuned.

Remember back in the day when people would rise to the challenge, instead of bitch and moan for the challenge to be lowered to their level?

[Anapingofness]

snip

Alright, I'll bite.

Firstly, I didn't try to do anything here, much less insinuate elitism. If I wanted to call you an elitist, I would have. And I certainly didn't attempt to vilify you. Instead, I too called it like I saw it (albeit with a dash of sarcasm).
In my experience, I have seen very little tolerance for newbies.
It didn't matter if they were prepared or not- to the eyes of some of the more experienced players they were all looking for carries. Nevermind the fact that I've seen a lot of experienced players derp around because they queued up for a duty they didn't particularly want to do, but wanted the tomes/gear/etc that drops from it.
Now, I'm not saying all newbies bother looking things up. I'm sure that a good amount of them decide to do whatever they want. However, a good amount of newbies also do their homework before entering DF or PF.

Secondly, just what more do you want newbies to do apart from look up guides, tips, and watch videos?
Eventually, they will have to get hands on experience and it will take some time before they get it down. That is of course if people bother sticking around for a wipe. Half the time you'll get people who just leave because there is a newbie in the group.

Thirdly- I'm placing this here just in case it needs to be said. I am of the idea that selling runs/clears is wrong and downright detrimental. I am also of the idea that newbies, especially newbies, should have to learn the mechanics of fights first before they can SR anything. So, I aim to help teach newbies that I come across so that they know how to handle the mechanics. The whole give a man a fish vs teach a man to fish thing.

That being said, it is normal not to want to keep wiping on content, especially when you know how to do that content. I have never argued this fact. I'll be the first to say that it is aggravating when it keeps happening. However, the lack of tolerance and patience from some of the experienced players is downright stupid. We all had to learn at some point.

[Kedrah]

I just really hate vote abandon. I'm not the type of person who likes to quit no matter what's going wrong, and I especially hate to be forced to quit against my will (I always vote no but rarely does it matter).

[DoctorPepper]

You really should make a party finder group for T5 and T9. Unless you get really lucky and end up with a party who knows the entire fight it will be difficult to get the win regardless of people abandoning, the queues are long for those because the DF is not an effective tool for completing them and it's as simple as that. If you're too lazy to make a PF group (not saying you are) then you shouldn't be complaining about people leaving when they don't think a party can complete the duty. All it takes is a couple bad people in T5 or a single bad person in T9 and most groups will not complete them.

I just really hate vote abandon. I'm not the type of person who likes to quit no matter what's going wrong, and I especially hate to be forced to quit against my will (I always vote no but rarely does it matter).

I'm sure the people who want to abandon hate being forced to stay against their will as well. The lockout makes vote abandon the only valid option if the majority of players do not want to continue and it takes at least half the players voting yes to work. I've been in parties where I stuck around for the entire duration and didn't win and I regret staying in every one of them.

If everybody was willing to kick people who want to leave instead of insulting them and refusing to kick them out of shear spite then there probably wouldn't be as many people who abandon. One person would get kicked and it gives other people an opportunity to leave without penalty as well.

[Kedrah]

I'm sure the people who want to abandon hate being forced to stay against their will as well. The lockout makes vote abandon the only valid option if the majority of players do not want to continue and it takes at least half the players voting yes to work. I've been in parties where I stuck around for the entire duration and didn't win and I regret staying in every one of them.

If everybody was willing to kick people who want to leave instead of insulting them and refusing to kick them out of shear spite then there probably wouldn't be as many people who abandon. One person would get kicked and it gives other people an opportunity to leave without penalty as well.

I've been in my share of plenty of parties that went terribly, but I'm really stubborn on that front and I always want to stick it out no matter what. :P As you said the better solution really is to be able to feasibly kick the people who want to leave instead of either forcing people to stay or forcing them to leave. It'd be nice if we had a "wanted to leave" option on the vote dismiss but I can see that being horribly abused, lol.