Fix Sumnmoner

[Akiza]

Summoner in FFXIV ARR is a Summoner in Name Only. What SE designed was an Arcanist with Fester not a Summoner. If SE intended to design a Summoner they would've made it a Elementalist/Summoner and focused the job more on the Summoner and Summon.

[Svalitz]

I've agreed since day one that this presentation of Summoner is a huge failure. I played SMN for 10+ years in XI, but have absolutely no interest this time. How a game from 2001 managed to pull off Summoner better than this is baffling (and SMN in XI had enough issues already, I mean I was more like a crappy WHM most of the time). SMN in XIV is just a major disappointment, and I'm not sure why they are reluctant to change it.

But here's my biggest gripe...

Our community of players constantly giving SE every possible reason NOT to change it.


If everything was sugar and rainbows and the world magically changed to be however you wanted it to be, would you honestly NOT want to be able to summon pets that looked better than the tiny-crappy Egi's?

If your answer anything but "HELL YES I WANT REAL SUMMONS", gtfo.


So why do we keep (as a community) making EXCUSES for SE to do nothing???

[Svalitz]

"It wouldn't make sense with the lore of the primals" SO CHANGE THE LORE. ENKIDU IS TECH A SUMMON. OMG LORE TURNED UPSIDE DOWN wut.

"Can you imagine how confusing it would be to have summons running around town or a party of summoners in a raid???" MAKE IT SO PETS CANT BE SUMMONED IN TOWN. SETTINGS > TURN OFF SUMMONED PET ANIMATIONS.

"Summoner would be so OP". DO A GOOD JOB OF DESIGN SO IT ISN'T.

"Garuda's bewbs". Good point.


So lets all stop supporting how crappy this job turned out as a group please and get some REAL summoners up in here. Thanks. They will only listen if we make noise and stop supporting their poor choices.

[Amaranthine]

I main SMN and do end game coil. On turn 13.
I find it very fun the way it is. Didn't like SMN in 11 as it was more SMN/WHM.
I love my dots. I can only go with the whole change enkindle to 120 seconds idea.

^^^^
Summoner is the best class in the game, if you can't take it don't try, go back to black mage cause we summoners don't need you giving us a bad name.

THANK YOU!

[Akiza]

^^^^
Summoner is the best class in the game, if you can't take it don't try, go back to black mage cause we summoners don't need you giving us a bad name.

THANK YOU!

This again the White Knights have spoken. Stop trying to defend SE's poor design of the Summoner and just admit it doesn't even represent its lore properly.
1st- Enkindle cool down does need to be changed to 120s
2nd- The Summoner's abilities don't even remotely line up with the job lore or its history. The Summoner harnesses the Energy of Elemental Primals and shape into Biddable Avatars. Obviously from the Lore the Summoner should have Elementalist Abilities and Pets should the focal point of the Job.

[Eloah]

...and SMN in XI had enough issues already, I mean I was more like a crappy WHM most of the time...

What you said right here is the exact reason why the summoner in this game is sorta the way it is. Guess what in this game you aren't a crappy WHM most of the time, you are a fully capable DPS job, that consistently deals high level damage. Oh and you SUMMON a pet to aid you. I mean people come on do you really want a class where you are on the sidelines half the time.

This again the White Knights have spoken. Stop trying to defend SE's poor design of the Summoner and just admit it doesn't even represent its lore properly.

There are no "White Knights" just people who can take the job for what it is and what SE was trying to do. No job in the series is ever represented exactly the same, bit as long as the main aspect is kept, the audience understands it. And oh hay, summoners have summons, whaddya know. And who are you to say that they don't represent the lore properly, did you create it? And what are these Elementalist abilities they should have, why can't the abilities they already have be Elementalist ones.

The real issue people are sick of is people complaining about summoner's lore and the way the job works. The job is fine as it is, otherwise players would be stuck on the sidelines, or be gimpy WHMs, as they were in XI, if the job was more "Historical". The community can agree that certain abilities and other issues could/should be changed. But as a whole, no, just no.

And SE, if you see this, please know the real suggestions/issues, from those people complaining that their water isn't wet enough.

[Akiza]

What you said right here is the exact reason why the summoner in this game is sorta the way it is. Guess what in this game you aren't a crappy WHM most of the time, you are a fully capable DPS job, that consistently deals high level damage. Oh and you SUMMON a pet to aid you. I mean people come on do you really want a class where you are on the sidelines half the time.



There are no "White Knights" just people who can take the job for what it is and what SE was trying to do. No job in the series is ever represented exactly the same, bit as long as the main aspect is kept, the audience understands it. And oh hay, summoners have summons, whaddya know. And who are you to say that they don't represent the lore properly, did you create it? And what are these Elementalist abilities they should have, why can't the abilities they already have be Elementalist ones.

The real issue people are sick of is people complaining about summoner's lore and the way the job works. The job is fine as it is, otherwise players would be stuck on the sidelines, or be gimpy WHMs, as they were in XI, if the job was more "Historical". The community can agree that certain abilities and other issues could/should be changed. But as a whole, no, just no.

And SE, if you see this, please know the real suggestions/issues, from those people complaining that their water isn't wet enough.

Elementalist abilities relate to the Elemental Primals. The Primals are the embodiment of 6 elements 8 if you count Zodiark and Hydaelyn
Ifrit-Avatar of Fire
Titan-Avatar of Earth
Garuda-Avatar of Wind
Leviathan-Avatar of Water
Ramuh-Avatar of Thunder
Shiva-Avatar of Ice
The Summoner's power comes from channelling the 6 Elements and Harnessing the Energy of the Elemental Primals and shape them into Biddable Avatars called Egis in the Allagan Language. According to the Summoner job lore provided by Y'mhtira the Summoner should be an Elementalist with the Pet as the Focal Point and without the Energy of the Primals the Summoner should just be an Ekementalist with the ability to cast tier 1 Elemental Spells(tier 2 if we count Heavensward).
This is how the current iteration of the Summoner should work.

[Eloah]

Elementalist abilities relate to the Elemental Primals. The Primals are the embodiment of 6 elements 8 if you count Zodiark and Hydaelyn
Ifrit-Avatar of Fire
Titan-Avatar of Earth
Garuda-Avatar of Wind
Leviathan-Avatar of Water
Ramuh-Avatar of Thunder
Shiva-Avatar of Ice
The Summoner's power comes from channelling the 6 Elements and Harnessing the Energy of the Elemental Primals and shape them into Biddable Avatars called Egis in the Allagan Language. According to the Summoner job lore provided by Y'mhtira the Summoner should be an Elementalist with the Pet as the Focal Point and without the Energy of the Primals the Summoner should just be an Ekementalist with the ability to cast tier 1 Elemental Spells(tier 2 if we count Heavensward).
This is how the current iteration of the Summoner should work.

While I understand this, and can admit that it sounds like it would've been an interesting idea, if not a little XI-esc; which SE was actively trying to avoid. I mean what you are saying is you basically want the summoner job from XI.

The idea is a little flawed however, in that an Elementalist could hold roots for several classic Final Fantasy jobs, Elementalist could be a precursor for Red Mage, it could've branched out into both Whm or Blm, they could even save an elementalist to become a Mystic Knight/Rune Knight, or a Geomancer.

There are many jobs that have similar "roles" Knight, Warrior, Paladin, Templar, all have shared skills, traits and names throughout the series. But holding one to anothers standard would be wrong.

And the Summoner lore makes sense in the game. The game basically states that the Summoners of the past were Arcanist who learned to harness the "essence" of the primals. There is no mention of elements, besides those of the primals, which is the essence. The Summoner job makes sense. It may not make sense to you, which is fine, but that doesn't mean it's wrong.

[Akiza]

While I understand this, and can admit that it sounds like it would've been an interesting idea, if not a little XI-esc; which SE was actively trying to avoid. I mean what you are saying is you basically want the summoner job from XI. The idea is a little flawed however, in that an Elementalist could hold roots for several classic Final Fantasy jobs, Elementalist could be a precursor for Red Mage, it could've branched out into both Whm or Blm, they could even save an elementalist to become a Mystic Knight/Rune Knight, or a Geomancer.

There are many jobs that have similar "roles" Knight, Warrior, Paladin, Templar, all have shared skills, traits and names throughout the series. But holding one to anothers standard would be wrong.

And the Summoner lore makes sense in the game. The game basically states that the Summoners of the past were Arcanist who learned to harness the "essence" of the primals. There is no mention of elements, besides those of the primals, which is the essence. The Summoner job makes sense. It may not make sense to you, which is fine, but that doesn't mean it's wrong.

In Final Fantasy V the Summoner had Elementalist abilities and could Summon
In Final Fantasy Tactics Advance the Summoner is a Elementalist that could summon so there is already a precedent.
Also the Elementalist lore in MMORPGs is closer to the Summoner than the Red Mage because of lore similarities
Red Mage -Weilds Swords can cast Black Magic and White Magic and are the Jack of all Trades
Elementalist- Channel Elemental forces and bind them into a physical form known as an Elemental.
Summoner- Harness the Energy of Primals and shape them into a biddable Avatar called an Egi.
As anyone can see the Elementalist is a base Summoner

[Alistaire]

don't you all understand even yoshi admite's this class is a huge failure.

citation needed