Fix Sumnmoner

[pandabearcat]

Since day 1 people have argued over what the "flavor" of SMN is supposed to be. Someone's always pushing for bigger summons or whatnot.

I agree with Eloah...changing flavor isn't going to happen.

What does need to happen is imo mechanics changes to SMN, not even numbers buffs.

Just small things like...mana issues, AoE burst, and egi usefulness.

[dragonczarxi]

need a quote for but yoshi has already stated in heavensward summoners (from my understanding) will benifit from spell speed, and it will affect when and how often dots will tick, that alone is a huge benifit

[Spellbinder]

Since day 1 people have argued over what the "flavor" of SMN is supposed to be. Someone's always pushing for bigger summons or whatnot.

I agree with Eloah...changing flavor isn't going to happen.

What does need to happen is imo mechanics changes to SMN, not even numbers buffs.

Just small things like...mana issues, AoE burst, and egi usefulness.

I find your comment here interesting, because it proposes (what I personally see as) two conflicting statements. Depending on how they're perceived, I think they are where a lot of disagreements in how to "fix" summoner stem from.

"changing flavor isn't going to happen."
"What does need to happen is imo mechanics changes[...] like [...] egi usefulness."

Just my personal opinion, but I think giving the Egi utility (and c'mon, if we're going to have five or more in the future, they all need to have a purpose) would greatly change the flavor of summoner compared to how it plays now.

Please note this isn't to start any arguments, just commenting on where I think a lot of the dissention between the people who do and don't want "change" comes from.

[pandabearcat]

I tend to think of my Egi as simply a dot with a health bar (which in some cases, is a pretty annoying drawback).

What I meant about giving more egi usefulness isn't really because I like one more than another, but I want them to be what shores up SMN weaknesses. So for example mechanically, if we have trouble with burst aoe, then one of the egis should help with that.

I suppose what I mean is that flavor isn't a reason enough alone to change things - it needs to have a mechanical impact or change the class in some way other than just "I like this playstyle better", or "I think this fits with my vision of summoner more".

[Koyuki38]

I want carbuncle to be back >.<

SE plz give him a purpose to exist as anything but a sub-garuda

[Akiza]

The problem is SE combined two classes that are difficult to balance a DoT class and a Pet class. DoT Classes always end up being mechanically broken or the developers implement them poorly while Dedicated Pet Classes end up being OP the draw back being it has a high skill cap.

The way to fix the Summoner is to make the Pets the focal point of the job while the DoTs become secondary just have Summoning Magic takeover. Give the Egis unique roles in the party.
Ifrit Egi- Single Target Bursts and increase physical damage
Titan Egi-Multi-Target Taking and party wide defense buffs
Garuda Egi-AoE Bursts and increase party wide spell speed
Leviathan Egi- High Sustained Single target DPS and Stuns
Ramuh Egi- AoE DoT Pet and Interuppts
Shiva Egi-Single target Tank inflicts heavy and slow

[pandabearcat]

There isn't a single class where the secondary abilities take over ... we need to stop worrying about the whole "class/job" difference, 1, because its confusing and 2, because likely it will change in heavensward what with the new jobs being jobs only, etc.

We cannot just "ignore dots" because that is the core of the ACN class, we'd have to completely gut all of our abilities and also our passives...this is something that simply can't happen while we're still tied to ACN and SCH. I think what we're all hoping is that the classes separate, but even then I think all that will happen is SCH gets their heals earlier and SMN gets a few skill tweaks.

[Keylus]

The principal issue with summoner is target swap, I think that make a spell to erase Bio, Bio II and Miasma from your current target and then apply the erased effects with his duration in another target could be useful

For more flavor: It could be fun if they remove fester and give at every summon an useful ability that costs aetherflow charges, it could be some like a DOT for Garuda, a direct attack for Ifrit and a defensive ability that affects the SMN for Titan.
An ability that let you swap summons without wipe 1/3 of your mana could be nice too

[Akiza]

The Summoner is hybrid class by nature but the focal point is the Summons. The problem is melee classes are pretty close to each other in terms of the application of DPS. Monk has the high sustained single target dps, Ninja is like Monk with no positional requirements and Dragoon is blunt damage. The only real difference between the melee is their abilities and animations each of them have high sustained single target dps. The Black Mage outclasses Summoner in every area of DPS to the point where the Summoner pointless. Melee DPS competes with each other but the Casters don't making the Black Mage the default caster. Give the Summoner more reliable Single Target Bursts and AoE Bursts by having Ifrit and Garuda fill that role forcing the Casters to compete with one another.

[Dyvid]

Is it me or does Ifrit Egi look bigger in the new benchmark?

https://youtu.be/ihj4e0QM3SY?t=6m13s