Warriors Viable?

[Hinata_Kenpachi]

Thought somebody bumped a thread from 2.0.

no I started this thread cause all the post I found on this subject was at least a couple months old

[Izsha]

Wars used to suck at 2.0. SE revamped the class and it's fine now. Some people still hold on to the stigma it used to have or see a crappy war and assume war sucks. Many also are bad at math and think defiance is crap compared to shield oath when in fact they are virtually identical.

A war played by someone with a brain is on equal footing with pld. There are some specific encounters that slightly favor 1 tank over another (frequent tank busters favor war due to inner beast all day every day like T5, while just long oeriods of sustained high damage favor pld cuz shield blocks like shiva ex) but both are adequate in all encounters.

The difference is war requires a little more finesse and timing to deal with extra layer of resource management (wrath) and balance debuff combos (eye and path) with enmity combo (butchers), and timing (IB is 6 sec so you have to land it more precicely to work properly) while pld just 1,2,3 till the cows come home and hit their prescribed instant CD when boss charges up their lazers.

War is easier to mess up, true, and that leads to a lot of bad experiences for people. But played properly they are extremely well balanced with properly played pld and synergies very well with them. The class is great, if it's played right. But that's the IF.

[TouchandFeel]

^^^
PLD played at its most basic is boring, I'll admit it straight up. Shield Oath+1,2,3+some flashes gets old fast, but from what I've seen in-game this is the way a lot of people play PLD and then they complain its boring.

PLD has a lot of other things to make it more interesting, like oath dancing to maximize dps and utility skills that can potentially be used in interesting ways, like Cover. However, its these exact things where Squenix dropped the ball on class/ability design IMO. The very things that can make PLD interesting to play are neutered to where their effectiveness and usefulness is debatable. Perfect example is Cover, seriously physical damage only wtf.

[TruebladeNuke]

Perfect example is Cover, seriously physical damage only wtf.

Well you got me there. I too have been questioning that. Cover should just... cover damage period, lol.

[Sanguisio]

Yes, they are definitely viable.

PLD afaik has more def CDs to run, but tbh they arent necessary as long as WAR pops IB, and use storms path its all good.

They take bigger numbers but that is scaled with their HP

[Artair]

WAR has less cooldown buttons but they are on a short cooldown meaning you pretty much always have something to pop even in fast paced fights. It's not just about the number of cooldowns though. WAR can do IB > 2GCD > Infuriate + IB for 12 seconds of 20% damage reduction every minute, + IBs in between. Warrior tanking is all about clever cooldown combinations and on the fly adjustments based on what you have available.

Bloodbath is severely underrated as a general damage softener. When you are self healing 250-300 damage every 2.5-3 seconds, thats up to 10% reduction in healing required if you are taking 3k damage every 3 seconds. Lasts 30 seconds and is on 90 sec cooldown. WAR should be combining cooldowns like this with offensive cooldowns like unchained and berserk for maximum effect, but it's not uncommon to find a 1,2,3 (or raw overpower spam) WAR getting much less mitigation from these cooldowns than they should be. Warrior should be played aggressively to get the most out of your toolkit.

If MTing as war storms path can mostly be used as a defensive cooldown only when needed in place of a BB combo so you don't lose any storms eye uptime. If you use the correct opener you can gain enough of a hate lead over PUG dps to just cycle SE/SP if you really need to. Using BB only when unchained and berserked is plenty to stay well ahead of anyone else on threat if you feel you really need full uptime on path.

To be fair to your FC, a bad WAR is waaay harder to heal than a bad PLD, but once you get to decent+ WAR vs decent+ PLD, the gap is near non existent.

[Altijacek]

Tbh, it doesn't matter. Both tanks are cool. Both tanks kick ass together. Just watch the opening video. Screw anyone who tells you otherwise. BOTH TANKS KICK THE ASS

[Ele_Pls]

It's much more common to see bad Warriors because essentially the Job is more 'complex', when in reality it just has more rotations and abilities and requires more attention. There are immeasurable amounts of bad Paladins around though, but it's far easier to get away with being a bad Paladin (low dps, bad CD management, etc) than it is to get away with being a bad Warrior.

There is no content that a Paladin can do that a Warrior can't do.

EDIT: As a Warrior main I get consistently bombarded with 'Paladin's make better MTs', which is bull. Either tank can MT any content without any trouble as long as they know what they're doing. Yes, Warrior has to time their Inner Beasts as opposed to mashing an oGCD ability, but all that takes is just paying attention.

[aerolol]

To topic creator:

Your FC has no idea of what they are talking about.
Maybe the healers just need to get good or other member are way too biased.

I have Main Tanked as Warrior all coil turns, 1 to 9, and all extreme primals, with 2 tanks or solo tanking.
It's totally possible and it's not bigger stress on healers if they are any good. Btw I have end-game geared SCH and WHM and i have also healed that.
In fact I prefer to heal warriors than to heal paladins, but both work.


On my group I main tank T10 and I'm the tank who picks 4 adds on phase 4 of this turn. There are tank swaps but I MT 75%+ of the time.
On T11 we have PLD main tanking and I make sure all debuffs (storm's path/eye) on boss are up all the time. I soak the Secondary head and PLD vokes back right after.
T12 there's not really a MT with so many swaps every minute or less, so both PLD and WAR are going to be tanking the fight 50% of the time.
T13 PLD main tanks first phase and I go full DPS out of defiance till phase transition. I grab adds on phase2, and me and PLD grab adds on 3rd phase as needed as well. Last phase we tank together to soak the damage.


By the way bringing 2 PLD (or 2 WAR) to FCoB is a big NO right now, both Storm's Path and Rage of Halone debuff should be up all times on every boss, every turn.

[Aurelinaus]

it's because when a war is present in the group and properly maintaining Storm's Path the PLD is also benefiting the from it and the damage reduction from their tank stance Shield Oath if it's up. One of the reasons I believe SwO mting is viable.