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  1. #11
    Player
    Anubis_Nephthys's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    343
    Character
    Anubis Nephthys
    World
    Goblin
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 60
    I read the OP and thought that surely someone would have corrected him by now, but alas.
    I'll educate you guys in DoTs.
    So your worry is that you may apply the dot, and it ticks, making the final tick happen 1 second after your DoT falls off.
    But get this, if you apply the DoT correctly, as soon as the next one falls off, you lose no ticks.
    So it boils down to managing DoTs correctly. In summary, all DoTs (duration/3) ticks.
    (0)

  2. #12
    Player
    Airget's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    2,612
    Character
    Airget Lamh
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Botanist Lv 100
    It's interesting to ponder where they might take it, I don't see them doing it where it increases the duration of the DoT unless they plan to change Garuda's ability but if they did do that it would be interesting.

    There are three ways they could go about adjusting DoTs with spell/skill speed

    Bio Potential DoT potency 240
    1: Increase DoT dmg Ex. Bio goes from 40 DoT to 45 DoT for 18 seconds Potential Potency=270
    2: Increase the duration of DOT Ex Bio goes from 18 seconds to 21 seconds Potency=280
    3: Decrease the tick rate of DoT Ex. Bio goes from 3 sec to 2.5 second tick Potency=288

    From the above 2 would be favorable, 3 would be hard to implement because of decimals and 1 could be interesting since we have these to think about.

    1=Increased dmg with DoTs upon applying but it doesn't effect your current rotation meaning that you will always apply them at the same time

    2=More time can be spent doing other things in that time frame, so let's say while yes it might not look like a lot but in terms of Summoner or Scholar using Ruin that extra 3 seconds in essence can amount to one more Ruin before having to apply Bio meaning that's an additional 80 damage because of change.

    In the sense of 2 the combat in a sense mimics the way Ninja works cause as they stand now they have the sense of having to pause mid-combo to apply jutsu or timing a jutsu before a certain combo ends or starts.

    With 1 things in essence remain the same but you'll deal more damage as the battle progresses, basically in that sense every 8 Bios would be like casting 9 Bios without the Buff which would mean every 8 Bios that would normally be a general potency of 1920 would now be 2160.

    However with increases duration we have a scenario where every 6 Bios is like 7 but on top of that 6 Ruins can take the place of the time one would reapply Bio with 18 second duration meaning that amusing, 2160 dmg would be dealt however this means that Bio with increased duration would be more potent than one that just increases damage because in the above of 8 Bios 144 seconds have passed, however with 6 Bios with 21 seconds duration only 126 seconds have passed. So then you pretty much have an extra 360 potency bringing the potency to 2520 however it would have to be near perfect execution to make it pay off but it would potentially add a higher level of strategy to DoT dmg dealing.

    Overall while at first I kinda liked the idea of dealing more base DoT dmg when it comes to making fights more dynamic the effect of skillspeed influencing the duration of the spell/skill sounds more enticing since it puts you into a scenario to adapt a new battle strategy based on the duration of DoT.

    Cause let's say it goes both ways, if DoT duration is influenced by spell/skill speed that would make abilities like Slow even more hazardous than it is to players because it would reduce their DoT duration and force them to have to reapply it sooner.

    I am definitely looking forward to whatever changes they may have in plan though since it will definitely make an interesting dynamic for NIN seeing as they have a self buff that greatly increases their skill speed/att speed.
    (0)

  3. #13
    Player
    Zfz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    2,371
    Character
    Celenir Istarkh
    World
    Atomos
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Anubis_Nephthys View Post
    So it boils down to managing DoTs correctly. In summary, all DoTs (duration/3) ticks.
    Let me try and find out exactly what the problem may be. Please do point out any mistakes I make.

    Each dash(-) is 0.5 second without the DoT debuff, each plus(+) is a potential tick at the instant.
    Each pipe(|) is application of the DoT at that instant, and star(*) means the DoT falling off at that instant.

    Suppose our DoT lasts for 6 seconds (2 ticks). For a 15 second duration:

    No DoT
    ----+------+------+------+------+--

    Various cases of apply and let it fall off, reapply in 0.5 seconds.
    --|--+------+----*-|-+------+-----*-+--
    ---|-+------+-----*-|+------+------*+--
    ----|+------+------*+-|-----+------+-*-
    Note that in the third case, there's one potential tick you miss out simply because it fell between your DoT applications.

    Various cases of reapplying 0.5 seconds before it falls off.
    |----+------+-|-----+------+|------+--
    -|---+------+--|----+------+-|-----+--
    --|--+------+---|---+------+--|----+--
    ---|-+------+----|--+------+---|---+--
    ----|+------+-----|-+------+----|--+--
    ----+|------+------|+------+-----|-+--
    ----+-|-----+------+|------+------|+--
    You'll realize that in the last case, the second duration of the debuff got only 1 tick.

    Now look at the first case of the early reapplication. The reapplication could actually be delayed for 2 seconds without missing any ticks.
    The closer your first application was to the previous tick time, the more you could space out your next reapplication.

    So let's look now at a 1 minute period utilizing the delay tactic for 1.5 seconds, mixed with the 0.5 second early reapplication:
    |----+------+--*---|-+------+----|--+------+---|---+------+--|----+------+--*
    ---|-+------+----|--+------+---|---+------+--|----+------+--*---|-+------+--
    And you should see the pattern here.

    We let it fell off 3 times, earning 4.5 seconds time we could use on other things.
    For example, that 1.5 seconds could let us complete a Ruin cast.
    This is a peculiar result of the system where ticks are not dependent on the debuff duration.

    Personally I'd prefer that this peculiarity be resolved on the server side by allowing some extension of debuff time.
    (0)
    Last edited by Zfz; 03-18-2015 at 06:47 PM.

  4. #14
    Player
    Yukiko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Nominsa
    Posts
    2,435
    Character
    Yukihko Kuroshima
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Summoner Lv 70
    I am sure they will not implement faster tick time of DoTs just after fixing the mana problem... would negate all the effort in fixing the issue (or they add new skills?)
    It is more likeley they will add some time to DoTs because analysing the mana fix we see ruin is now "cheaper", so how to make use of it if not with "more" spaming?
    I just dont think they will add more button smashing... what is left is increasing damage for each tick!
    (0)
    Last edited by Yukiko; 03-18-2015 at 09:42 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Blackoutz View Post
    Naja ich hab einfach gemerkt, dass man mit Mut und Freundlichkeit viel weiter kommt und den Menschen eine Freude macht :3
    Weißt du, wenn wir alle an einem Strang hier im Forum ziehen, dann kommen wir einfach so viel weiter und stärken die gesammte Community <3

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