Pure RNG is the worst thing ever.

[FranSeara]

I refuse to believe someone could be dumb enough to think RNG makes anything fair or even.
There's nothing fair about gettings something in 16 hours that someone else got in 1 minute.

Its FAIR because how else do you TEACH or TELL a computer to hand out items in a fair and even maner. The computer can't tell or deem who is worthy to receive items. RNG is the computer's form of FAIRNESS. This is coming from someone who has completed the Zodiac quest line 3 times. Some days you win,some days you lose. Remeber the Devs words "Not everyone will complete the relic quest"

[Risvertasashi]

The computer can't tell or deem who is worthy to receive items.

Sure it can. PRNG and Token systems have both been used in online gaming to great effect, just as an example.

Computers do exactly what we instruct them to do. Normalizing outliers has been well within the capabilities of calculators from the time it was a job title rather than a piece of electronics.

Pure Mersenne Twister works, ish, but it's a bit antiquated nowadays.

[ziddyt]

Its FAIR because how else do you TEACH or TELL a computer to hand out items in a fair and even maner. The computer can't tell or deem who is worthy to receive items. RNG is the computer's form of FAIRNESS. This is coming from someone who has completed the Zodiac quest line 3 times. Some days you win,some days you lose. Remeber the Devs words "Not everyone will complete the relic quest"

The same way it does with all the non-rng aspects of this game? Tomes, seals, notes, etc. All that stuff requires even work to get the same reward (barring books), an even amount of which can be exchanged for different rewards at the same price across the board.
That's pretty damn "fair."

[NyarukoW]

.... RNG is the computer's form of FAIRNESS. ....

Sorry, but just like a computer/program/software/alogrithm can not "tell or deem who is worthy", the RNG is not a substitute for fairness. Fairness is a human set policy that is beyond the realm of a Turing complete machine. RNG doesn't even begin to be fair or define fair.

The fairness that exist with a system that uses some RNG is that SE has let player chose to play by those same rules knowing that RNG dictate their odds to win loot.

The thing is, bottom line, there will always be two camps on this. One side likes to have unbounded RNG, often because they have been lucky and the other side which wants to have RNG bounded, so that RNG can only be early and never late. SE has both in play, but for some items it is unbounded RNG that frustrates those that want the drop to happen after X amount of tries/times.

[FranSeara]

Sorry, but just like a computer/program/software/alogrithm can not "tell or deem who is worthy", the RNG is not a substitute for fairness.

The way I view it. The way the relic and other RNG elements in this game work to eliminate "Discrimination". No one stop you from solo Q'ing into any Zodiac Df. No one can stop you from getting the zodaic items. No one can stop you from light farming. The RNG in the relic quest is the great Equaizer, no one can stop other then yourself. This beats Raid groups,PF group FCs and many other things in this game. Most player controlled things in this game practice some form of Discrimination. The RNG in the Relic can't discrimate, so Its true fairness. In other words its Consistent. I dont know of any other way you could make this quest work. Other then a skill base quest...which would lead players to discriminate each other.

[Ophie-Mio]

The RNG in the relic quest is the great Equaizer, no one can stop other then yourself. This beats Raid groups,PF group FCs and many other things in this game. Most player controlled things in this game practice some form of Discrimination. The RNG in the Relic can't discrimate, so Its true fairness. In other words its Consistent. I dont know of any other way you could make this quest work. Other then a skill base quest...which would lead players to discriminate each other.

RNG is not an equalizer. Someone can either do it 20+ times and someone else does it once. Sometime has to work hard for all of it and then there's someone who doesn't. The difficulty of the relic is the great equalizer. It being of such low level content means that everyone can do it no matter the skill level.

The other things you mentioned? Raid groups, PF group, FCs, they are all player controlled things that have base standards. You yourself as a player are the only one who can decide if you don't qualify for it. If they want someone with experience for a farm run...if you don't have the experience, that's your fault. Raid groups? They ask for clears or certain percentages...don't have it? Not their fault. They did their work and time for it. You don't need to assemble 8 other people before you decide to have a learning party for relevant content. Look up a PF and join in. That's you and only you preventing yourself from doing that.

And FCs? Rarely do Free companies ever discriminate and if they do, it's because they want a friends only sort of deal. At that point, that's RNG of not meeting someone at the right time.

[Felis]

RNG is not an equalizer. Someone can either do it 20+ times and someone else does it once. Sometime has to work hard for all of it and then there's someone who doesn't.

Nobody get an Atma in the first FATE everytime. Over time (8*12 Atmas) it evens out, give everyone the same average amount of tries

[SendohJin]

The RNG in the relic quest is the great Equaizer, no one can stop other then yourself. This beats Raid groups,PF group FCs and many other things in this game. Most player controlled things in this game practice some form of Discrimination. The RNG in the Relic can't discrimate, so Its true fairness. In other words its Consistent. I dont know of any other way you could make this quest work. Other then a skill base quest...which would lead players to discriminate each other.

"Diamond Dust" is true fairness - contribute to 5 wins you get rewarded. how does that discriminate? how is that less consistent?

[Ophie-Mio]

"Diamond Dust" is true fairness - contribute to 5 wins you get rewarded. how does that discriminate? how is that less consistent?

Because according to Fran Seara, even joining a winning Shiva EX group is a privilege and involving some discrimination. Though to her, seeing "Farm group - Please have cleared" is a discrimination that someone can't necessarily overcome.

[FranSeara]

"Diamond Dust" is true fairness - contribute to 5 wins you get rewarded. how does that discriminate? how is that less consistent?

And I got 30 of them and still no weapon. PRICELESS
But,its Fair. me no cry.