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  1. #1
    Player
    Empty-handed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    297
    Character
    Empty Handed
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Leatherworker Lv 60
    the engine is made in way that YOU CANNOT progress unless you have some mandatory skills from other jobs. you cannot make end game gear without maxing out the other jobs. some were complementary. but as the difficulty increased with the introduction of 3 stars and 4stars. i can see that most skills are pretty much needed. (some you can substitute or discard. looking at you innovation/ingeuity2 lol).

    if they remove this dependency somehow then maybe its ok to specialize in some/certain crafts.

    like please, dont put Terminus Putty in all my recipe books again. where im forced to buy it back when they added 3stars for pretty much everything. i hated unlocking alchemist book just to make terminus putty. it was overpriced for no reason and was included in every important 3star recipe (you needed 2 per synth). this dependency needs to go :/
    (0)

  2. #2
    Player
    Squand's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2014
    Posts
    74
    Character
    Squander Dalfast
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Alchemist Lv 54
    Quote Originally Posted by Empty-handed View Post
    snip/
    I don't understand what you want and what you don't want? You want specialization, because you don't want to buy other people's goods?

    "YOU CANNOT progress unless..."
    This isn't true, and after your caps lock declaration you point that out. But beyond! your two examples let me add, you will have extreme difficulty HQing items. But it's not impossible. And there is plenty of money to be made in NQ items. If someone wanted to be just a weaver, they could totally do it.

    Your example of Terminus putty really confuses me? It highlights the fact that we already have specialization. (Lots of people are 50 without alchemist 50 or alchemist master book 2.) And Terminus Putty is also the poster child for why people want this change. People are arguing for that lack of omni craft so traders have to trade with other traders. You could certainly buy all matts, and only make end product and make gil.
    (0)
    Last edited by Squand; 03-11-2015 at 01:45 PM.

  3. #3
    Player
    LineageRazor's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Posts
    3,822
    Character
    Lineage Razor
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Goldsmith Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Empty-handed View Post
    (some you can substitute or discard. looking at you innovation/ingeuity2 lol).
    Or Flawless Synthesis. Srsly, SE? SE? Srsly.

    like please, dont put Terminus Putty in all my recipe books again. where im forced to buy it back when they added 3stars for pretty much everything. i hated unlocking alchemist book just to make terminus putty. it was overpriced for no reason and was included in every important 3star recipe (you needed 2 per synth). this dependency needs to go :/
    Unfortunately, if they do go to a specialist system, I think you can expect stuff like this to happen MORE, not LESS. The goal of specialization is to get crafters trading amongst one another rather than hunkering down and doing everything themselves. Therefore, I would expect to see almost every craft have valuable products that other crafts need, but cannot produce themselves. Not only will you need to buy some new form of Terminus Putty, but also Dragon Leather, Adaman Plates, Orichalcum Ingots, and so on and so forth.
    (0)

  4. #4
    Player
    Alx789's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    239
    Character
    Vik Ktototam
    World
    Phoenix
    Main Class
    Archer Lv 60
    LineageRazor, your post means that to be an invalid with reduced abilities is better than to have them all. GL with such opinion )
    All crafter's leveling to 50 and after 50 even more says - u need to be able to craft everything because market is a very unstable thing. It can be speculated, can be undercutted with some days of relax, can be empty. Crafters who can produce/gather various materials and end products themselves can avoid this disappointments, 1-skileed invalids - no.
    Exitennce of more than one financial systems means that SE IS UNABLE TO CREATE STABLE ECONOMICS SYSTEM. Making players invalid specialists with one skill will destabilise gil market, i am sure in it. It's good for speculants, not for market.
    (1)
    Last edited by Alx789; 03-11-2015 at 12:44 AM.

  5. #5
    Player
    miles00001001's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    9
    Character
    Vanagaerion Sindaraug
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Carpenter Lv 50
    Former XI player here, up to Aht Uhrgan. Compared to the battle classes, the restrictions placed on leveling the crafting classes always felt like it went against the spirit of the game and it was an aspect of the game that I often heard complaints about. In XI if you were serious about crafting you had alts so you could max out in everything.

    Even if you weren't serious about crafting, you could just level a class to 100 you thought would benefit you the most. For the most part the recipes had very little overlap with the other crafting classes and relied much more on raw materials or refined materials from earlier levels of the same class. Barring a "sub-class" needing to be a certain level for higher level synths, there wasn't an incentive to level all the crafts on a single character.

    XIV is a different system, and has always lauded itself about only needing one character to do everything. As early as level 1 you have recipes that require materials from other crafts. Each tier typically has materials from other crafts of the same level. You can't reliably make HQ items without using cross-class level 50 skills.

    I think specializations are something that go against the design of the game and will ultimately ruin the markets. Look at the current desynth system for a precursor of this. There are items only obtainable by culinarian desynth--how expensive are those on your server? Granted, they're mostly glamour fodder, but the exclusivity/specialization has created that inflation.

    With the zodiac materials, compare the cost of the weaver/ltw/gsm/bsm desynthed items to the arm/alc/cul/crp desynthed items. This is because most people take gsm/ltw/wvr due to needing the fieldcraft and mastercraft materia for crafting. It wasn't until more of those desynth skills could obtain these demimateria that the cost of fieldcraft dropped.

    Specialization will just make synths that would normally be expensive even more so. It punishes players that not only enjoy the crafting aspect of the game, but have learned to expect to be able to do all the crafts on a single character.

    I don't understand why the dev's just don't allow the time investment and cost of being an omnicrafter to be its own gating mechanism.
    (5)

  6. #6
    Player
    Kiara's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    1,462
    Character
    Kiara Silvermoon
    World
    Masamune
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 60
    Quote Originally Posted by miles00001001 View Post
    Specialization will just make synths that would normally be expensive even more so. It punishes players that not only enjoy the crafting aspect of the game, but have learned to expect to be able to do all the crafts on a single character.

    I don't understand why the dev's just don't allow the time investment and cost of being an omnicrafter to be its own gating mechanism.
    Totally agree.

    I really hope the Dev Team reads your post and Gillionaire's and everyone else's expressing concern.

    * Inherently (because of the amount of hassle alone), the current Crafting System (up to Lucis Tools) *is* already a Natural "Gating Mechanism."

    Most of the semi-serious / serious Crafters starting in 2.0 - 2.2 I know have already ended up "specializing" and focusing only on 1 - 3 Crafts because of Time Commitments and not wanting to bother grinding.

    Please let that be the only "gate" you need, and not a Forced Lockout (like Desynth) or whatever was hinted at during PAX East. For those that want to put in the time (and heck, if we're putting in more Time, it means more Subscription / Monthly Fees for you, Square-Enix!), let them earn their way to Max Crafting in ALL Crafting Jobs in 3.0.

    No Lockout / Forced Specialization, please.

    Thanks.
    (2)

  7. #7
    Player
    Gillionaire's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Gilsa Mogilsa
    Posts
    329
    Character
    Pippi Longstocking
    World
    Jenova
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by ZephyrAM View Post
    Even if they didn't do any of that, specialization would prevent complete mastery on one character
    But that's a very core concept of the game. For some, it's the selling point.
    Having so much to do is what's keeping me in this game despite pvp being non-existent. I pvp on the market boards.. and I would hate my playing field to be reduced to 2-3 items.






    Quote Originally Posted by miles00001001 View Post
    There are items only obtainable by culinarian desynth--how expensive are those on your server?
    On a side note..
    Play a Lalafell and you will NEVER have the urge to spend money on swimsuit glamours.. just "try on" and see..
    You would know :P
    (4)
    Last edited by Gillionaire; 03-11-2015 at 05:07 AM.

  8. #8
    Player
    miles00001001's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    9
    Character
    Vanagaerion Sindaraug
    World
    Gilgamesh
    Main Class
    Carpenter Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Gillionaire View Post
    On a side note..
    Play a Lalafell and you will NEVER have the urge to spend money on swimsuit glamours.. just "try on" and see..
    You would know :P
    I -AM- a lala and totally rock the south sea's talisman. Might be a different story as a female, when you look like the Coppertone baby. :-/
    (0)

  9. 04-06-2015 07:57 AM

  10. #10
    Player
    ZephyrAM's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    244
    Character
    Lynia Celeste
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 52
    Crafting specialization allows SE to simply do 'more' with the crafts then they currently can. Maybe they could add bonuses to the specialization that they don't want to stack, under any circumstances? Or add pieces of BoP gear or glamours that require the specialization, so that no character could have them all? Or, as someone else mentioned, add some sort of 'request craft' to make specializations useful to each other between characters, not all in one? All of these would make mastering the crafts with different alts nearly useless, as you still wouldn't be able to do it all 'for' one character.

    Even if they didn't do any of that, specialization would prevent complete mastery on one character, or trade or economy or whatever reason they see as important. Sure, people 'could' create 8 characters to each master one craft a piece, but the sheer amount of time, effort, and gil required to do that is 'massively' higher then doing it all on one character, especially up front. Whatever their reasons, specialization will certainly get them there.
    (0)
    http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodestone/character/1556132 ~ Lynia Celeste

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