summoner dps how to do it

[Havenchild]

I see, that makes sense. Anyway you could help me with my other question as well regarding a BiS list using the dreadwyrm grimoire? I have both dread boots and kirimu boots. Should I add the platinum ring? If so how should I meld these two items? Thx

http://ffxiv.ariyala.com/QJAO

Skip the ring in your case if you decide to use the crafted shoes.

This is one of the possible final builds I was going to sit at with my zeta outside of my current one. Ultimately if you ever do get a zeta with crit/det capped, this will be one of the best builds you can make. It works with the Dreadwyrm book as well.

[Fatshine]

Hmm, should I really be using Flaming Crush single target on cooldown? This thread has been really interesting. I changed my gear set and parsed 12 points higher on a dummy.

[Havenchild]

Hmm, should I really be using Flaming Crush single target on cooldown? This thread has been really interesting. I changed my gear set and parsed 12 points higher on a dummy.

It has the same potency as Crimson Cyclone. The only reason you may want to delay it is if an AoE situation is slightly possible or to couple a Rouse/Spur with it.

EDIT: Right crimson cyclone ._.

[Fatshine]

Snip

You mean Crimson Cyclone lol. Also another question, how did you come up with 520 Crit minimum? My current build is the same as yours except the crafted items, and I am working on Zeta. I have a perfect meld Apocalypse. Therefore my stats are 652 Int 371 Det 495 Crit. I was thinking of swapping the Dread Bracelet for the Poetics and gamble with the 1 lower Acc by positioning my pet at flank (T13 problem only). The alternative is swapping Poetics neck for Dread but I shudder at the overload of Accuracy and all those wasted stats.

Even though my Critical Hit is considered low by what you have stated, I parsed considerably higher than my original build.

[Havenchild]

You mean Crimson Cyclone lol. Also another question, how did you come up with 520 Crit minimum? My current build is the same as yours except the crafted items, and I am working on Zeta. I have a perfect meld Apocalypse. Therefore my stats are 652 Int 371 Det 495 Crit. I was thinking of swapping the Dread Bracelet for the Poetics and gamble with the 1 lower Acc by positioning my pet at flank (T13 problem only). The alternative is swapping Poetics neck for Dread but I shudder at the overload of Accuracy and all those wasted stats.

Even though my Critical Hit is considered low by what you have stated, I parsed considerably higher than my original build.

Ultimately, it's not backed by any particular science but what I noticed from looking at parses.

I have a theory on Critical Hit Rate in general and I don't think the formula for it is entirely linear.

What never made sense to me was how Critical Hit Rate and the Formula literally related. When you think about it, when you are leveling up, you have all these stats and can Crit regardless but its only at 512 Crit Rate that you are finally considered at least according to the formula to be hitting 10% Crit Rate. That doesn't line up with the fact though that you can Crit as often with considerably lower then 512 Crit when you are leveling.

Now at the same time at level 50, past 540 Critical, I noticed I wasn't actually Critting considerably more at 545+ then when I was at 540. I started trying it at different increments from the 512 -> 545 and noticed over particular numbers, you begin to reflect accurately, via parser, a jump when you cross over particular numbers.

When you think about it in relation to other classes, classes like MNK crit considerably more even outside of IR, when leveling up, despite the fact we should be at similar numbers.

This all lead me to my current theory that at least on SMN, you fall into particular thresholds of Crit. When you cross over a certain number, this pushes you into a new threshold where you will reliably Crit as often. 512 is when you cross over the particular shift, but for me, when I crossed 520, I felt the jump based off Festers and Ruins critting more often. At 530, I again saw another notable jump and finally at 540. but after 545, nothing seems to change. Just to make sure about post 545, I had to parser that and noticed it was in fact true. So the diminishing returns start at around 545.

So anyway that's why I recommend 520. I tried to prove my theory with a friend of mine equally skilled as me and he feels as long as you can get DET to cover the Crit, you can equally still do similar damage. He wasn't able to parse higher but to some extent I believe his theory is also true because he was able to keep up, perhaps 10 DPS off after like 3 mins but he can't get higher DET then me atm lol

PS: Puros calc also seems to support the fact that a notable drop in Crit can theoretically harm you more often. Using theoretical gains from Crit of course.

[Judge_Xero]

What never made sense to me was how Critical Hit Rate and the Formula literally related. When you think about it, when you are leveling up, you have all these stats and can Crit regardless but its only at 512 Crit Rate that you are finally considered at least according to the formula to be hitting 10% Crit Rate. That doesn't line up with the fact though that you can Crit as often with considerably lower then 512 Crit when you are leveling.

Isn't this just because your base crit and %/Crit Rate is higher at lower levels?

Like for any given level, with no gear equipped you are sitting @ 5% Crit Rate and each point of Crit would give you a higher % than it would at level 50. Similar to Skill/Spell Speed, you are always @ 2.5GCD and each point of that lowers your GCD more than it does at 50.

So @ Lvl 60 cap - the 14 Crit may not be 1% anymore. It might be closer to 15.5 Crit Rate = 1%. Also our minimum Crit Rate will be higher (currently 341 @ 50), but our base % will probably still be 5%.

[pandabearcat]

That doesn't seem like a very good way to do crit.

It seems more anecdotal.

It may however be possible that enemies have a crit threshold per level, so for example if you have 500 crit and their crit suppression is 450 crit, then you only get 50 crit worth of points, while if you had 520 you have 70 crit worth of points, an effective 40% crit increase even though you only have a 4% actual crit rating increase.

Therefore the value of crit jumps up past a threshold then falls back down (relatively).

[Havenchild]

That doesn't seem like a very good way to do crit.

It seems more anecdotal.

It may however be possible that enemies have a crit threshold per level, so for example if you have 500 crit and their crit suppression is 450 crit, then you only get 50 crit worth of points, while if you had 520 you have 70 crit worth of points, an effective 40% crit increase even though you only have a 4% actual crit rating increase.

Therefore the value of crit jumps up past a threshold then falls back down (relatively).

Like I said it's not balanced by any particular science. I only go off what I feel has been the most effective in game from what I've also seen on parse. If we were to go purely by the formulas suggested then I would be completely wrong on that. However, I don't base my stat build purely on what the formulas state, but what's actually working in-game. If we listened to purely formulas, then by all accounts INT will always beat DET in almost any given ratio, which I find especially on Summoner to be hardly true.

At the end of it all, it's meant to be just that a Recommendation.

PS: Incidently, alot of my findings from what I see in game coincide with what Japanese players theorize regarding the damage formulas and how each stats value is not exactly static.

https://dervyxiv.wordpress.com/2015/...mage-formulas/

This is a pretty good read of the differences between the NA / JP scenes.

[pandabearcat]

I didn't mean that your intuition was incorrect or that it is bad advice, I just wish the stats were more lucid.

It certainly doesn't help gearing any.

[melflomil]

On my SCH i have 644 Crit. i can put on average about 150 DPS. For those times my Crit fluctuate between 33% and 27%