Bismarck

[Cherub]

Just imagining the raw notes of Moose make me shiver with excitement. I'd also support a raw release if it wouldn't take up much of your time. I'd be one who would enjoy reading all the theories and thoughts from now and back then. I do have a lot of free time too which also adds to it :>

[Vydos]

I'm just chiming in this thread, to mention that we should not take the benchmark video into account about Bismark. Each benchmark had things in it that ended up not appearing in game or altered.
It's after all something to test performance of the pc. Remember the gigantic tortoise, people fighting Ifrit somewhere in Thanalan, mindflayer + dragon combo as final boss in Tam-Tara deepcroft and so on.

[Themis]

people fighting Ifrit somewhere in Thanalan

There was that time that Yoshi-P mentioned something about a design plan to have Primals appear in the open world for FCs to defeat and capture, with the ability to summon him themselves. This idea seems to be lost to the design process, though. Which is unfortunate as a FATE style battle with Primals other than Odin would have been quite fun, even if the promise of summoning was not a reward.

[Zohar_Lahar]

So Heavensward is out, and....I'm still stumped on why Roegadyn mythology would feature the Vanu Vanu primal. The seas couldn't have gotten that high in the Sixth Umbral Calamity, could it?

[WyrahFhurrst]

So Heavensward is out, and....I'm still stumped on why Roegadyn mythology would feature the Vanu Vanu primal. The seas couldn't have gotten that high in the Sixth Umbral Calamity, could it?

Ah! That's probably quite simple. The Vanu Vanu never actually call him Bismarck, they only ever call him "The White." More likely is that the word of the Roegadyn myth has spread enough that when someone spotted the Sky Whale, they called him that and that's what he's been known as by the spoken races since.

[Lusavari]

The call him Bismark directly in his first appearance if you watch that Cutscene over again. I think Bismarck is mentioned a few times by name when you ask around to learn his history as well, how he was born a white whale, and so the other whales hated him, and tore him asunder.

[Enkidoh]

Ah! That's probably quite simple. The Vanu Vanu never actually call him Bismarck, they only ever call him "The White." More likely is that the word of the Roegadyn myth has spread enough that when someone spotted the Sky Whale, they called him that and that's what he's been known as by the spoken races since.

That's actually not correct - the vanu actually do call him Bismarck, in fact, the first time you actually see it a vanu specifically calls him that and 'the White':

Vanu Elder: "The White! The White! Mighty Bismarck, Lord of the Mists!"
Haurchefant: "A flying whale?! By the Fury, i-it's a Primal!"

Of course the docile untempered vanu of Ok'Zundu never call their tribe's deity 'Bismarck', simply referring to him as 'the White', and regarding the Primal Bismarck (rightly) as an abomination and sacrilegious to their faith (the fact it goes around eating floating islands whole certainly wouldn't put in their good books, so that leaves us back at the beginning - why is the Primal version of the vanu deity named for a figure from roegadyn myth?

EDIT: sniped by Lusavari.

[Belhi]

They actually have an origin story of Bismarck. They say he once swam in the ocean (which matches the Roe legend). However one day the other whales turned on him and tore him asunder. He was saved by some goddess (hazy on this detail but it was definitely some form of divinity) and given the power to swim through the clouds gifting him with an ocean to swim in. As he swam he saw upon the ground others who were like him ostracised for their differences and he rescued them carrying them into the sky. There he created a land upon they could live peacefully. Those rescued were the Vanu Vanu and the land Bismarck created for them was the isles in the Sea of Clouds.

Possible spin off of this Myth I considered is that the actual Bismarck could have been a vessel, perhaps a Allagan Airship that carried them to the Sea of Clouds. The oppression they suffered could be linked to Allag research since they seem to have had a hand in at least one beast tribes origins and myths. As for the link between the Roe and Vanu Vanu legend, It could be that thing the Roe thought was a whale in ancient times and whatever carried the Vanu Vanu to the Sea of Clouds was the same thing. We know that Seal Rock has Allag artifacts so the Allag were active in the neighbourhood. Submersible Airship maybe? Underwater Allag research facility?

[myahele]

@Belhi

That's what I am thinking, too. That the "Bismark" that the Vanu Vanu were transported in was just an Allagan Ship, perhaps it's defining feature being White, especially if we're to believe that UFO might be Allagan. Maybe it was white in order to best conceal itself in the clouds? After all, the Vanu Vanu say that Bismark was white when all of the rest of it's kind was black.

We now know that an old Lominsan Legend turned out to be an Allagan research base: Seal Rock

maybe the "-marck" in Bismarck may just be Mark? As in BiS Mk.2?