I just had an interesting idea of how Relic weapons should be upgraded

[Edellis]

The problem with the Zodiac grind is that, there is NOTHING about ANY of the content chosen for it that any high-level player would ever want to run. The relic weapon was an uphill battle, at ilv50 you want to fight the new primals. But after you get past that, the game has you go backwards into stuff so weak and boring, i have to level sync to run it.

Why would I ever want to run this stuff on my lv50 character again? If you could get the items on alts, that'd be cool, but i'm not even getting Experience for this crap. It's a complete and utter waste of time.

[thunderbreak]

The problem with the Zodiac grind is that, there is NOTHING about ANY of the content chosen for it that any high-level player would ever want to run. The relic weapon was an uphill battle, at ilv50 you want to fight the new primals. But after you get past that, the game has you go backwards into stuff so weak and boring, i have to level sync to run it.

Why would I ever want to run this stuff on my lv50 character again? If you could get the items on alts, that'd be cool, but i'm not even getting Experience for this crap. It's a complete and utter waste of time.

I hear ya, they want to do this so low level stuff still have participants, which I can understand. But what they need to do to encourage new players to join, and encourage current players to level an alt class. It's just so backwards.

[Chihaya]

No, the currency weapons are the easy content.

Which part of "far from fair" are you not seeing in player's feedbacks?

And by your definition, if someone who actually enjoys doing low level dungeon, spirit bonding, doing FATEs, and doing Primal HM and they do it on a regular basis anyways without the relic reward. Then SE implemented the current relic grind method. Then they are getting a free weapon out of it, and you'd be against that too?

You do realize currency weapons requires you to Coil at first right?
It get nerfed later on as the content gets old, much like atma drop rate is increased and the rate of light getting doubled.
Relic process will most likely get nerfed even more in the future as new things come out, but it should not be given to you for doing something that you are already doing anyways - getting new gear.

The problem with the Zodiac grind is that, there is NOTHING about ANY of the content chosen for it that any high-level player would ever want to run. The relic weapon was an uphill battle, at ilv50 you want to fight the new primals. But after you get past that, the game has you go backwards into stuff so weak and boring, i have to level sync to run it.

Why would I ever want to run this stuff on my lv50 character again? If you could get the items on alts, that'd be cool, but i'm not even getting Experience for this crap. It's a complete and utter waste of time.

You can say that for most MMOs - doing the same raids - farming the same dungeons over and over again for tomes/tokens to get gear - all of it is a waste of time - gaming itself is a way to kill time.

But as long there's that carrot on the end of the stick, you are going to do it.

[thunderbreak]

You do realize currency weapons requires you to Coil at first right?
It get nerfed later on as the content gets old, much like atma drop rate is increased and the rate of light getting doubled.
Relic process will most likely get nerfed even more in the future as new things come out, but it should not be given to you for doing something that you are already doing anyways - getting new gear.

Yet I see more people hold ilv 110 currency weapons than Relic Zeta or Coil. Just because it's ilv is lower doesn't make it less useful. I've out DPSed Zeta wielders, I've held aggro against triple flares from Zeta wielders, and I've healed 8+ mob pulls all using ilv 110 weapons. Your misconception is focusing on ilv. Like what Craige mentioned earlier, ilv means nothing. Besides, I'm standing at Gold Saucer right now, checking out players, I see lots of their relic is still on Atma - Novus.

Currency weapons are designed to be always 1 tier behind, they are the weapon meant for casuals. They will suffice with normal to hard contents, they won't even have the minimum accuracy requirement for the current tier raid, which is what Relic and Raid weapons are meant for. Since casuals don't raid, why would they need raid tier weapons? The way weapon progression should be, is currency weapon first, the relic, then raid weapon. Currency weapon will carry you until you get your relic, and your relic will help you earn your raid.

Because the method of acquirement of the current relic, it takes the longest to obtain. And give the least reward for the effort. Like what most say, at one point, investing time to Raid becomes a better choice. Right now relic is the most "hardcore" content in the game as it requires the most dedication and time. That's counter productive.

And you can continue to hang on to your "getting new gear" thing. I've already pointed out the flaw in your logic with my previous post. To summarize what you are trying to enforce, if people get contents by grind things they find fun, or something they would grind normally, it's unacceptable. They need to pay 12-15 bucks a month, grind what they don't find fun at all, and get a POS that's barely worth their time, that's the acceptable way.

[Chihaya]

Why the heck are you complaining if you think i110 currency weapon is suffice - if it's good enough for you then great.

Craiger is actually using ilvl as a counter argument to your free relic based on your ilvl
We don't necessary support the way the grind it is now but from what he said he does not support the removable of the grind wall - there should be a change to the grind but it should not be removed.

Currency weapons are designed to be always 1 tier behind, they are the weapon meant for casuals. They will suffice with normal to hard contents, they won't even have the minimum accuracy requirement for the current tier raid, which is what Relic and Raid weapons are meant for. Since casuals don't raid, why would they need raid tier weapons?

Accuracy requirement what? you don't have accuracy on relic unless you meld it, and not all raid weapon even have accuracy? And according to you... since casuals don't raid, why would they need.... anything?

Edit: And yes, I do NOT see how capping your tomes/poetics for new gear is much of a grind - you are doing it already, and the reward is new gear but now asking for more reward for it. Nor do I see running the same few dungeons on ex roulette to cap poetic as "fun".

[thunderbreak]

Why the heck are you complaining if you think i110 currency weapon is suffice - if it's good enough for you then great.

Craiger is actually using ilvl as a counter argument to your free relic based on your ilvl
We don't necessary support the way the grind it is now but from what he said he does not support the removable of the grind wall - there should be a change to the grind but it should not be removed.


Accuracy requirement what? you don't have accuracy on relic unless you meld it, and not all raid weapon even have accuracy? And according to you... since casuals don't raid, why would they need.... anything?

Edit: And yes, I do NOT see how capping your tomes/poetics for new gear is much of a grind - you are doing it already and now asking for more reward for it. Nor do I see running the same few dungeons on ex roulette to cap poetic as "fun".

...I think your ability to read and comprehend is impaired, because you have so many contradiction in your own writing, it pretty much just eats itself up.


This conversation is turning into something very unproductive, and I can't make you have compassion. So I'll end this discussion between us with this lol:



And I recommend Wild Star to you, I think a player like you will feel right at home.

[Chihaya]

And I recommend you to read the replies in the thread and see how little support you have on your method and how many are against it

[thunderbreak]

And I recommend you to read the replies in the thread and see how little support you have on your method and how many are against it

No need, all I have to do is go through the forums, count how many threads are complaining about Zodiac Relic quest, and know I've tried to pitch in and suggest solutions, as oppose to people who just sit there and judge. That thought along make it all worth my time.

[TinyMonster]

I somewhat agree with you the grind is horrible but I'm against your idea.
I don't want to have to get a better ilvl JUST to get my relic. Some stats on poetic gear is just not great for me but you'd "force" me to get that gear. Look getting the relic is totally optional, there's plenty of other choices out there if you don't want to do it.

I get it I'm right there in the grind (took me 2 weeks to get 72 Alex, and materials), this grind is very bad but I refuse your idea I'm sorry.

Also, I refuse to ever touch Titan Ex again! I'd take hunts or dungeons instead. I don't care about primals hell I'm still at Levi Ex.

[gamesmart]

snip of i don't even know

Do you see a lot of Poetics weapons around? No, because that's still locked to Final Coil. Back in 2.2, those Soldiery weapons were the same deal - accessible only through Second Coil. Now, 9 months later, of course it's different, just like how Atma and Nexus were made easier.

Relic didn't surpass Augmented Ironworks Magitek weapons until a week and a half ago. Most everything is made easier over time, and you should know this.

Relics are obtainable without stepping foot into any sort of "hard" content, and the devs learned that if they're easily obtainable (such as the original relic, and Zenith were) then they have no worth. That's why it's a grind, and if you think it's not worth the time investment then why are you doing it? And they're hardly garbage, properly infused Zetas are better than even Dreadwyrm weapons. People cleared Final Coil in the first week using their RELICS. Not soldiery weapons, not High Allagan weapons, RELICS.

Stop trying to take a dump on Chihaya just because she disagrees with you (for good reason). Also nice strawman in your last paragraph.