It's time to reevaluate the idea of adding a PLEX/Chronoscroll-like system to FFXIV

[Snugglebutt]

More people would stop playing this game than start playing if became P2W and I have played a lot of F2P MMO's that use P2W things in their cash shops and stuff like PLEX...none bar Eve have been very successful financially after implementing such systems and I think WoW will find might head in same direction alongside its continued decline over the past few years where they implement one bad idea after another. Even Eve continues to be plagued by RMT spams and RMT continues to thrive in that game.

PLEX wont help in either tackling bots or RMT as no game I played which had supported P2W methods managed to stop RMT and had the opposite effect on botting numbers where more people botted in those games not less due to an even bigger discrepancy between the have and have not's only this time fueled by real world money used to gain in game advantages that not everyone could afford.

SE has always been against P2W, they have always tried to avoid putting things in place which is considered P2W which is why for example the cash shop is limited to vanity items that they tried to stop being sold or traded. Just because they lacked foresight on a couple things like the rings for example in which people used it in a way it was not intended to be used doesn't mean SE should give up and change their stance by legalizing more P2W systems and methods.

As such this discussion is kind of moot, it goes against what SE has clearly intended for this game. I cannot imagine SE implementing a PLEX system, not now or in future and I among many others am glad of that. If that stance by them changed I know for a fact I would stop playing and as shown by the uproar over the worry the cash shop would offer pay to win services prior to it's implementation, I know I would not be alone in leaving.

[Magis]

I didn't ask about what they said. I asked what they did. And what they did is tell players that no steps were being taken to change the situation and that no punishments would be issued to anyone who partakes in the system of trading gil for wedding bands.

"What the did" and "What they said" is the same thing, what are you even babbling about? No, actually the GMs were telling people to read between the lines and totally actually meant they wanted this to happen. This is why we can convert IRL money int.... oh wait that isn't the case, and hasn't been since EB came out. You really are reaching aren't you?

If the GM said "this is bad" but decided not to punish player for doing so due to their mistake, it doesn't all of a sudden mean the opposite and turn into "actually we are 100% fine with this". Same shit with people exploiting the levequests to fast level their characters. No one was banned over it but SE did patch it out and say this wasn't suppose to happen.

[Tiggy]

I didn't ask about what they said. I asked what they did. And what they did is tell players that no steps were being taken to change the situation and that no punishments would be issued to anyone who partakes in the system of trading gil for wedding bands.

That still doesn't mean anything to support your specific claim. It could be as simple as they realized early that while they don't like it the rate at which they sell is so low it isn't a big deal and they can put it off to later since they are busy working on the Saucer and Expansion right now. It can be just that simple. It does not automatically make your correct or that they'd be ok with this kind of system. You're making assumptions about their intent solely because of silence.

[Intaki]

"What the did" and "What they said" is the same thing, what are you even babbling about? No, actually the GMs were telling people to read between the lines and totally actually meant they wanted this to happen. This is why we can convert IRL money int.... oh wait that isn't the case, and hasn't been since EB came out. You really are reach aren't you.

SE straight out came forward and said (with their actions, if not words) that buying gil with real money via rings was entirely legit and they would do nothing to penalize the people who chose to engage in that activity. This is a fact that you really don't seem to be fond of.

[Havenchild]

Please, continue thinking I'm arguing your point when all I did was point out your fallacy. I don't really care what people do or don't have uses for 130 gear. That's outside of the scope of this thread entirely. You're building a strawman to distract me from the focus of the thread which is about a plex system. Not the gear people need/use for what content. That's a distraction.

Also I love to hear what is Pay 2 Win in this game. Buying Coil runs? Buying crafted gear, that usually can be made if you had the materials / classes? I never understood this crafted gear argument when most people who are actually good on there classes can play better with less gear then those who are buying this stuff and those that already play good on their classes and got crafted gear, would have likely beat whatever content anyway with the current gear..

This argument makes very little sense in the competitive environment. Considering groups have downed things like T13 in 110 soldiery gear, it's proven already that unless your going for World Firsts, which I'm very sure most of the posters in this thread are not and didn't accomplish such, this doesn't affect you via Pay 2 Win.

My group just downed T13 for the first time 2 weeks ago. I can assure you we aren't so good to do it in 110 gear or even 120 gear. Most of us are 130 and we beat it with 2 seconds until enrage. There is no way we'd beat it with 110 gear and I guarantee you most groups are the same way. So please try to remember that just because .0001% of the players are capable of doing it in 110 is NOT in any way shape or form proof that ANYONE can do it in 110 gear and therefore your entire assertion is completely flawed at it's core. You don't balance MMOs around it's most extreme minority of highest skilled players. That should be obvious.

You are trying to counter my point of saying it is possible, by deliberately mentioning how your group struggled and you wouldn't have been able to do so.


My original point is countering the misconception that players are getting an advantage via Pay 2 Win which many are misusing in this thread. I then ask, Pay 2 Win at what? Coil? Crafting? Gearing? I've stated plenty of how you actually don't get an advantage in any of these, as the same content has been tackled with gear that's widely available to the playerbase already.

Others being able to buy crafted gear is not an argument as to how this is in fact Pay 2 Win by supporting this type of game subscription purchase. All of this is connected to this thread and not a strawman as people keep using Pay 2 Win as a counter to this subscription model. If you're going to use straw manning, use it correctly.

[Tiggy]

SE straight out came forward and said (with their actions, if not words) that buying gil with real money via rings was entirely legit and they would do nothing to penalize the people who chose to engage in that activity. This is a fact that you really don't seem to be fond of.

Lol what? No they didn't. They specifically asked players not to do it and that they didn't want them to do it.

Pay 2 Win at what? Coil? Crafting? Gearing?

Are you completely unaware of what people in this thread have been asking for that I have to explain it to you? I'm sorry if you're this many pages deep and you don't even understand the kind of trade goods they have been arguing on about for pages then that's on you. I'm not going to be a book report.

Also, that quote you dropped of mine doesn't prove your point in the slightest. Stop trying to distract the point of the discussion with straw men that have nothing to do with it. I'm not going to argue the merits of any individual purchases using plex like tokens in game. That's not the point of this thread. That has more to do with game balance than plex and you damn well know it. You could theoretically buy anything in the game with the gil you gain by trading tokens. That's a deeply personal issue to each player and his goals.

[DoctorPepper]

SE straight out came forward and said (with their actions, if not words) that buying gil with real money via rings was entirely legit and they would do nothing to penalize the people who chose to engage in that activity. This is a fact that you really don't seem to be fond of.

lol actually they came out saying that the only reason it was possible is so that you could buy a bracelet for your partner, encouraged people to stop buying them for RMT purposes, and specifically said that if people continue to do it they will look for an alternative solution. So no, it's not a fact, it's your rear talking.

[Intaki]

Lol what? No they didn't. They specifically asked players not to do it and that they didn't want them to do it.

Oh! Really? So what steps are they planning to take to stop it? I mean, if they're so against it, surely these horrible players buying gil with money are going to have the book thrown at them hard by SE!

[Tiggy]

Oh! Really? So what steps are they planning to take to stop it? I mean, if they're so against it, surely these horrible players buying gil with money are going to have the book thrown at them hard by SE!

At what point did taking steps have ANYTHING AT ALL to do with words type on a page instructing their intent? You seem to think two unrelated things (actions and words) are equal. They aren't.

Lack of enforcement does not mean it's ok when they explicitly said it wasn't ok. You're using lack of enforcement as an excuse.

[Havenchild]

lol actually they came out saying that the only reason it was possible is so that you could buy a bracelet for your partner, encouraged people to stop buying them for RMT purposes, and specifically said that if people continue to do it they will look for an alternative solution. So no, it's not a fact, it's your rear talking.

And yet people did it anyway, and yet no one reportedly got banned for it.