So I was kicked from Halatali today

[FranSeara]

Dps'ing on heals takes some players longer to get use to. I started sch. at lv 50 and taught myself how to heal. It took some time to get "OK' with throwing some Dps in.
Op, just heal untill you feel ok dps'ing, at low levels no one should be kicking you for not dps'ing on heals.

"Remeber not everyone feels the same way you do" "Some of US just wanna have fun and play a GAME"

[SeraviEdalborez]

It's sad that 90% of this topic is ok with being mediocre and lazy because "it's just a game" or "healing is healer's only job" or "it's only a couple minutes saved on the whole run". You are one of many things wrong with the game's community, much moreso than the so-called "elitists" who are "oppressing" you. None of these are reasons to be willfully awful.

If you truly believe that you MUST stand there like a vegetable in case someone gets a boo boo, you have zero sense of risk assessment. If you truly believe this in Halatali normal at level 50, you are lazy. Please do play a job that isn't healer if you feel this is too much of a burden on your skill level. Everyone will thank you for it and hopefully you'll be better at your new endeavor.

It's bad enough that run of the mill DPS can't be held to any kind of standard because parsers are the devil and nobody can take any criticism without crying "elitist". Don't need to add your ilk to it.

I approve of that party's willingness to not tolerate another player's laziness. I deplore the OP's rationale that they did nothing worthy of criticism. Healing is not such a care-intensive job. The only way you learn your limits is to push them. OP and many babysitters in this thread have never pushed so much as a piece of paper.

[Delorean]

just let loose a sigh of relief, remember not all players are that stupid, and move on to the next one

i am not sure what good it will do to report someone for abusing vote kick, but it really can't hurt you to file a report either

While I don't agree that you should have been kicked, you should have helped damage.
nothing in that, and most pre-50 dungeons, is going to take you by suprise.

it is a reality that most players will never play at the highest level. I think it is incredibly tight-assed of someone to demand every player maximize their role to it's full potential, because it's an extremely unrealistic expectation.

Your aim should be to be flexible rather than inflexible. You are going to have a hard time trying to hammer a square peg into a round hole.

I mean, you can ask for one thing... But it doesn't stop a player from asking another. I've been abandoned by tanks complaining about me doing DPS while they were in no danger of dying. And we also did every boss up to the last one in Dzemael Darkhold without a tank.

[Cynfael]

It's sad that 90% of this topic is ok with being mediocre and lazy because "it's just a game" or "healing is healer's only job" or "it's only a couple minutes saved on the whole run". You are one of many things wrong with the game's community, much moreso than the so-called "elitists" who are "oppressing" you. None of these are reasons to be willfully awful.If you truly believe that you MUST stand there like a vegetable in case someone gets a boo boo, you have zero sense of risk assessment. If you truly believe this in Halatali normal at level 50, you are lazy. Please do play a job that isn't healer if you feel this is too much of a burden on your skill level. Everyone will thank you for it and hopefully you'll be better at your new endeavor.

It's bad enough that run of the mill DPS can't be held to any kind of standard because parsers are the devil and nobody can take any criticism without crying "elitist". Don't need to add your ilk to it.

I approve of that party's willingness to not tolerate another player's laziness. I deplore the OP's rationale that they did nothing worthy of criticism. Healing is not such a care-intensive job. The only way you learn your limits is to push them. OP and many babysitters in this thread have never pushed so much as a piece of paper.

I think part of the problem is this strange mass expectation that healers are there to recover people from virtually any mistake.

If my party or alliance members get themselves killed by playing poorly, I won't sweat it at all. Sure, I will make every reasonable effort to prevent unnecessary deaths, but I won't stand around wasting my time on the off-chance that someone might eat avoidable damage. If they are so bad that I have to follow them around keeping them topped off in order to prevent them from dying, then their contribution to the fight is most likely not worth preserving. Better to leave them dead so that they can't be targeted by mechanics and potentially take others down with them.

Besides, a good healer is worth quite a bit more than a bad DPS in terms of overall raid damage and utility. All the gear in the world doesn't automatically make a DPS good at their job, and a strong healer can surpass the damage output of an unskilled DPS in casual content all while keeping the party healthy.

[ChameleonMS]

... and nobody can take any criticism without crying "elitist". Don't need to add your ilk to it. I approve of that party's willingness to not tolerate another player's laziness. I deplore the OP's rationale that they did nothing worthy of criticism.

OP's position is not about laziness but about skill. OP did not feel comfortable DPSing.
OP's complaint was not about the criticism, it was about the "penalty" imposed.
Kicking a person instead of educating that player serves no true value. But, Elitist A**holes are going to be Elitist A**holes.

Having observed your profile on LODESTONE, I will say congratulations, you are an Elite player by what you have accomplished in this game; all classes done, FCoB gear, etc....
Then comparing it to OPs profile, 2 lv50, and only a couple of items above i110.
Your experience level compared to OPs is significantly different. You have accrued significantly more skill through you obvious time and dedication to the game. Your judgement is "Elitist" simply because you are expecting OPs playing skill to rival how you would play in that situation.

[Chihaya]

If you are constantly healing, then ok, it was a retarded kick.

If you are standing around doing nothing 80% of the time, you should make yourself more useful.

But I still wouldn't kick you for it.

[SeraviEdalborez]

OP's position is not about laziness but about skill. OP did not feel comfortable DPSing.
OP's complaint was not about the criticism, it was about the "penalty" imposed.
Kicking a person instead of educating that player serves no true value. But, Elitist A**holes are going to be Elitist A**holes.

Having observed your profile on LODESTONE, I will say congratulations, you are an Elite player by what you have accomplished in this game; all classes done, FCoB gear, etc....
Then comparing it to OPs profile, 2 lv50, and only a couple of items above i110.
Your experience level compared to OPs is significantly different. You have accrued significantly more skill through you obvious time and dedication to the game. Your judgement is "Elitist" simply because you are expecting OPs playing skill to rival how you would play in that situation.

Why is my stance invalid just because I'm on top of the game? Why is it not applicable just because others are not where I am? It's the same advice: try. Do something. Fail so that you know how to succeed. This is how DPS maximize DPS, how tanks maximize DPS, and healers maximize DPS + minimize excess healing.

Healers are some of the laziest and lowest performing players in this game at every level of play, including Coil. The fact that most wait for healing to be needed is seriously not a good thing in any case because anything that needs to be healed should be prehealed for the most part. This is something you don't learn sitting on your thumbs. You try this "wait and heal" thing in Coil and you will let people die all day.

This is a Mr Miyagi thing, wax on wax off. If you DPS hard enough and keep people alive, you learned how little you need to heal and the gaps you can fill with damage/something. If you let them die because you got too tunnel visioned, you learned a limit. You can work to that limit or try to optimize so that it doesn't cause another death. You never learn this limit unless you try. You can apply this directly to an endgame encounter by instead using those gaps for MP generation. Then when you're comfortable enough with THAT burden, you can DPS again.

You can replace the word "laziness" with whatever makes you feel better but it is what it is. A lack of skill is perfectly fixable. A lack of effort is generally not.

[chidarake]

when im tanking dungeons which seems to be quite often I totally expect the healer to keep the group alive first, with me being priority.

however the majority of dungeons easily allow for healers to dps if they are comfortable in doing so but I don't see it as mandatory, but seriously if you have enough time for 1 gdc or more to go by without having to worry then why not dps.?

I can understand being more cautious with new people as op said though and I believe it is a judgement call on whatever class any given player is playing at the time in what is the best course of action in any given situation.

we all have roles to play and they should be our primary concern, but upping your game and pushing yourself should also be a personal challenge at all times.

[Milleus]

Q: Why do people not play healers?
A: because of people like SeraviEdalborez
Just kidding

Excellent healers know how to DPS and heal - which is basically what Seravi is talking about.
You'll have to constantly push yourselves to improve if you want to get there.

However, I feel that it is unfair for people to expect all healers to be able to do both?
My stance is that a healers job is to heal. But if you can heal and DPS, that's an added bonus to the group.
Perhaps I have lower expectations of my pug healers?

[Llyren]

Excellent healers know how to DPS and heal - which is basically what Seravi is talking about.
You'll have to constantly push yourselves to improve if you want to get there.

However, I feel that it is unfair for people to expect all healers to be able to do both?
My stance is that a healers job is to heal. But if you can heal and DPS, that's an added bonus to the group.
Perhaps I have lower expectations of my pug healers?

I have lower expectations of pug healers. Heck pug everything. I do not expect pugs to be playing as hard as possible. I expect about 70-90% success at the mechanics

Improving does tend to take some self pushing sure, but I don't demand that of others in a pug run.