3.0 hopefully not tome-cap reloaded

**Anty** · 02-28-2015 01:57 AM

Originally Posted by Wobble

Weekly/Daily caps = Subscription security so highly unlikely they will lift them.

it's also dangerous. Especially with weekly lockouts and the mmo competition isn't sleeping either.
If you are done on day 2 after the reset and don't feel like grinding cards or play triad the rest of the day then you look for other games. That cannot be their intention

**Wobble** · 02-28-2015 02:14 AM

Originally Posted by Anty

it's also dangerous. Especially with weekly lockouts and the mmo competition isn't sleeping either.
If you are done on day 2 after the reset and don't feel like grinding cards or play triad the rest of the day then you look for other games. That cannot be their intention

This is true. I myself don't play other MMO's but most of the time anymore I get on do my daily roulettes and treasure maps and now get a scratch off in GS and log off and watch TV or Netflix. The game is getting really stale to me anymore...

**Whocareswhatmynameis** · 02-28-2015 02:29 AM

If they uncapped poetics, ppl would have all the poetics they need in 1-2 weeks, then interest in the game would plummet as the next post you would make is "Theres nothing to do in this game"

Spacing the content out allows people that enjoy playing the game to have other people to play with.

**Gardes** · 02-28-2015 02:56 AM

Even if they modified the way not-from-raid gear drops, they will still implement speed bumps somehow. Letting casual players play for short amounts of time every week and not fall behind has been one of yoship's most important goals. Hell, apparently he doesn't care if people don't sub constantly. Remember the early interviews where he 'doesn't mind if people only sub for a month after every update and then come back again for the next content update in 2-3 months? Yeah.

Edit: asking for tome cap to be job specific is insane. There's going to be tank, heal, caster, monk, dragoon, ninja, machinist/bard (or even separate). That's potentially 7 to 8 pools to max every week and about 3000+ tomes to collect every week. And that's if drk and ast shares their gear with others of the same role. Let's not forget about the shared accesories for dps that doesnt share the body gear? How are you going to decide which pool of tomes is it spent on? Even if I pick 'just' three pools to cap every week (let's say war, drg, sch), it's going to be such a huge pain to grind dungeons that will all be easy and get boring quickly like usual. I imagine I'd have to no life the game pretty hard. With ex and trial roulette, I get roughly 90 tomes a day and for 7 days a week I get 630 tomes. For just 3 jobs alone, I need 1350 and unless the roulette bonus is job specific, I'm gonna have to do pure dungeons about..a dozen times? That's about 19 or so times in a week. If they make roulette bonus job specific, I'd have to do 15 of ex and trial roulettes just to cover 3 jobs every week.

I have all jobs at lvl 50 and they're ALL i107+ and they can all tackle every content but FCOB (I use war for fcob, drg second highest and is fcob ready) because of the way SE designed the structure of content (casual friendly and non strict ilvl req) and I don't see it changing in heavensward to the point where you NEED the latest tome gear to beat the latest content outside of alexander hard. Current tome cap limit is fine.

**Drako** · 02-28-2015 04:45 AM

Originally Posted by Gardes

Even if they modified the way not-from-raid gear drops, they will still implement speed bumps somehow. Letting casual players play for short amounts of time every week and not fall behind has been one of yoship's most important goals.

That idea works fine if your talking about people that have been playing from the get go. But for people that start a character mid way, it has the opposite of the intended effect. Maybe they could have a relaxed cap for newbies or something, until maybe they get their first job to a certain ilvl.

The cap limit on tomes, weekly lockout.. We have it so no-lifes (playing all the day and probably eating fatty junkfood) dont hit newest released higher ILVL in 1 day. <-<

Unfortunately the loot lockout isn't really preventing this anyways. It only slows it a little bit. Instead of having the elite capped out and completing coil in a day. We now have them completing it in a week. The people that don't want to grind, and fall behind, still do fall behind anyways. You just have the illusion that they have the same edge as everyone else. But at the end of the day if they are determined like a hardcore, they will be beyond many other people. If anything the loot lockout is hurting the casual more then its helping. The people like me that need that gear edge to help with some of that slower response/learning. Gear obviously isn't a automatic win, but it can make a difference.

**Interstella** · 02-28-2015 02:58 AM

I think having a cap per role or job is a great idea.

At the moment one can only obtain tomes through:
- Dungeons
- Raids
- Hunts

Is there any other way? PvP?

If these are the only ways, then I think it'd be incredibly boring to cap tomes on each role/job.
- I don't think people will farm raids for tomes and wouldn't people just find the most efficient dungeon and spam this over and over?

Wouldn't it also be rather time consuming, especially for those who are not awarded extra for being an "Adventurer in Need"?
- (I'm mainly thinking of those who do not have a group to spam a dungeon with)
- Would you consider increasing the amount rewarded through dungeons/hunts/raids/dailies?

**Risvertasashi** · 02-28-2015 03:02 AM

Originally Posted by Interstella

At the moment one can only obtain tomes through:
- Dungeons
- Raids
- Hunts

Is there any other way? PvP?

PVP will give you a grand total of 40 poetics if completed through the PVP roulette. Coupled with expert roulette it's pretty nice. Normally they give 20 poetics per match, which to me isn't worth it on its own.

Originally Posted by Anty

by the way i like your signature lol

Thanks. I suspect it's something a lot of players can empathize with XD

**LineageRazor** · 02-28-2015 04:48 AM

When it comes to MMO's, no matter how carefully you design them, there will be players that play at different rates. Whether it's because they're sacrificing their social life by spending every moment of free time glued to the monitor, mortgaging their future by blowing off school or work, or are simply idly rich and don't need to worry about work or education, or any of a myriad of other possible reasons, there are plenty of people who can complete ANY reasonable amount of major-update content in short order, if completely unrestricted. These people will gobble up content, then become bored and unsubscribe when there's nothing left to do a week into the patch.

At the other end of the spectrum, there are players who have school, work, friends, and/or family obligations that strictly limit how much time they can spend playing the game. These people will become frustrated and unsubscribe if the bar is set too high on what it takes to progress and be successful in the game - especially if there seem to be a lot of people progressing at a much faster rate due to an ability to play the game for many more hours per week.

SE needs to strike a delicate balance to keep as many of the former subscribers without badly offending the latter, and vice versa. "Just add more content so prolific players never run out of things to do," is a pipe dream. SE doesn't have the manpower for that. NO ONE has the manpower for that. Perhaps in a few years, FFXIV will have enough built-up content to manage this, but it's too much to expect to see every major patch. "Make content more grindy to keep players playing longer," will alienate the latter category of players, as it will take them even longer to advance, even if it manages to serve to keep the former around longer.

Weekly lockouts and daily quests are pretty much the ideal way to keep both sets of players from unsubscribing. While a prolific player may be able to do everything doable each week in just a day or two, the ability to unsubscribe until the next patch isn't an option since they still need to log in each week to gradually complete the content from THIS patch. Meanwhile, a casual player who barely plays enough even to max tomestones each week has less of a feeling of being left behind - they're progressing (as far as tomestones go, at any rate) exactly as quickly as even the most frenzied of red-bull-fueled gamers.

There is no ideal solution to the problem that will satisfy everyone, and I doubt that there ever will be. As a semi-casual player, though, I think the weekly caps are a pretty good way to please as many people as possible while displeasing as few people as possible.

**Galdous** · 02-28-2015 05:29 AM

The current system works fine. Last thing I need for is for people with no lives able to 135 I level up every job on their characters and push other players who do not sink in so much time because static groups require new apps to be max gear in a range/tank/heal/melee dps role.

**Edellis** · 02-28-2015 05:49 AM

Very unlikely to change.

The tome cap is a pretty fair method of limiting progression. Afterall, high-tome gear is never the top-tier gear in the game, and only really serves as a way to assure gear progression despite RNG. Removing limits only removes that soft time lock on gear acquisition, which in truth is actually locked by the difficulty of the trails your static can farm.

If there was theoretically no cap on Poetics ATM, you'd be able to farm away until i120...but at that point, you'd still need to effectively complete Final Coil to upgrade it to 130 or get the Dreadwyrm drops. And fat chance with that, because a party of i120ish players can still easily struggle beating Turn 9.

Ultimately, some sort of timewall MUST exist, for the developer's sake. The tome cap is a better alternative to limiting than pure RNG, which sucks sausage.

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