[dev1026] Changes to Claiming and Engaging Enemies

[Meimei]

Want to know the major difference between powerleveling in XI and XIV? Kill speed.

In FFXI you're simply cured by an outside party while fighting mobs that might normally rape your face, because of this, your killspeed can be a tad slow. So exp gained is still moderately regulated. This will not be the case in FFXIV, with level 50 (and someday beyond) characters one-shotting your mobs with absolutely no repercussions or penalties.

Frankly I am shocked, it feels as though all the leveling we've trudged through until this point has been in absolute vain. In my opinion it's far too early for something of this magnitude to be dropped onto a system that's meant to be stable (even if it didn't exactly turn out that way.)

There are so very many, many, many other ways to fix the current claiming system. Yoshi, are you not even willing to explore those avenues? Are you in such a rush you forget common game environment equilibrium? You claim to be doing this in an effort to bring players closer together, but this is assuming the majority of players are in fact going to be doing this out of the sheer goodness of their hearts. You don't take into account the inevitable dual/triple/quadruple/etc boxers and bot abuse that's bound to follow. There will be absolutely no credit nor achievement felt from undertaking the journey to the end levels after this. Imagine if, in FFXI, Abyssea came out in 2005 instead of last year. That's kind of what's going to happen here...

I'm not sure what else to say that hasn't been said dozens of times already, this is not going to end well. I'm so very, very disappointed. My trust in your judgment has wavered, sir. :/

If this PLing works with Disciples of the Land and Hand, as well (Stone Throw/Wrist Flick to tag mobs) then this game shouldn't even be called a game anymore. You can rest assured I'll be pending my resignation should this be the case.

[Dargoth_Draconia]

Want to know the major difference between powerleveling in XI and XIV? Kill speed.

In FFXI you're simply cured by an outside party while fighting mobs that might normally rape your face, because of this, your killspeed can be a tad slow. So exp gained is still moderately regulated. This will not be the case in FFXIV, with level 50 (and someday beyond) characters one-shotting your mobs with absolutely no repercussions or penalties.

Frankly I am shocked, it feels as though all the leveling we've trudged through until this point has been in absolute vain. In my opinion it's far too early for something of this magnitude to be dropped onto a system that's meant to be stable (even if it didn't exactly turn out that way.)

There are so very many, many, many other ways to fix the current claiming system. Yoshi, are you not even willing to explore those avenues? Are you in such a rush you forget common game environment equilibrium? You claim to be doing this in an effort to bring players closer together, but this is assuming the majority of players are in fact going to be doing this out of the sheer goodness of their hearts. You don't take into account the inevitable dual/triple/quadruple/etc boxers and bot abuse that's bound to follow. There will be absolutely no credit nor achievement felt from undertaking the journey to the end levels after this. Imagine if, in FFXI, Abyssea came out in 2005 instead of last year. That's kind of what's going to happen here...

I'm not sure what else to say that hasn't been said dozens of times already, this is not going to end well. I'm so very, very disappointed. My trust in your judgment has wavered, sir. :/

If this PLing works with Disciples of the Land and Hand, as well (Stone Throw/Wrist Flick to tag mobs) then this game shouldn't even be called a game anymore. You can rest assured I'll be pending my resignation should this be the case.

Back in the day it was slow, but as soon as they added level sync and you could keep your party at the best exp/speed ratio then mobs died in a few seconds and exp was capped. I don't really feel like the leveling we done was in vain because who is to say there is going to be anyone who wants to take time to power level you unless its done vice versa and even then most people have most classes at 50 at this point. It is going to be beneficial for not us persay but persuading new players to come and join and any of your friends that will start on the PS3 and you will be able to help them level if you want to catch up so they can do end game content with you. In FFXIV there are many different types of players ones who will only do group based leveling up and then solo players so I am not overly worried that everyone is just going to be power leveling everyone and normal leveling is going to go out the door.

There isn't really a way to fix the current claiming system easily it is easy to break this one down and rebuilt one that the brand new team knows by heart and will be able to fix with ease if something breaks or needs to be tweaked. You have to remember when Yoshi-P took over that not only was he new but so was his whole team. That being said they came into the middle of a system that is flawed and they don't know the ins and outs of the current programming. Current claiming system kind of sucks and is buggy and flawed and they don't know how to work on it as easily as they could with a new system created by themselves.

You said it isn't going to end well, it is instead going to not end at all. It is going to be flawless and work amazingly. Like he said not everyone is going to be happy and he might drive a couple fans away even though I don't see this being a game breaking element by any means. With the few that leave we will gain two or three times more who enjoy it and like something new and fresh.

[Sephrick]

Want to know the major difference between powerleveling in XI and XIV? Kill speed.

In FFXI you're simply cured by an outside party while fighting mobs that might normally rape your face, because of this, your killspeed can be a tad slow. So exp gained is still moderately regulated. This will not be the case in FFXIV, with level 50 (and someday beyond) characters one-shotting your mobs with absolutely no repercussions or penalties.

In most cases, the PL tanked, grabbing hate via large cures. Thus, most PL'd parties were DD heavy boosting kill speed.

Frankly I am shocked, it feels as though all the leveling we've trudged through until this point has been in absolute vain. In my opinion it's far too early for something of this magnitude to be dropped onto a system that's meant to be stable (even if it didn't exactly turn out that way.)

We've all been playing this game for the last year knowing SE's intent was to completely change it from the ground up. To be shocked at SE delivering on those drastic changes is unreasonable.

There are so very many, many, many other ways to fix the current claiming system. Yoshi, are you not even willing to explore those avenues? Are you in such a rush you forget common game environment equilibrium? You claim to be doing this in an effort to bring players closer together, but this is assuming the majority of players are in fact going to be doing this out of the sheer goodness of their hearts. You don't take into account the inevitable dual/triple/quadruple/etc boxers and bot abuse that's bound to follow.

By investigating logs, it is possible to identify for-profit violators and mete out punishment, but it would be very difficult to completely put an end to these actions. Doing so would require implementing very complicated specs, which will place a strain on ordinary users.

Distribute experience points based on the amount of damage done to the monster
Distribute experience points based on hate

The above methods were used by first generation MMOs to reduce power leveling, but these methods have their own problems. Players can aggressively fight each other over experience points, classes that do not do much damage are at a disadvantage, and for-profit violators can create bots that randomly attack monsters and steal EXP. (As I said earlier, we will punish for-profit violators. However, we do not want to ban ordinary players, so it will take us time to properly identify for-profit violators.)

There will be absolutely no credit nor achievement felt from undertaking the journey to the end levels after this. Imagine if, in FFXI, Abyssea came out in 2005 instead of last year. That's kind of what's going to happen here...

Good. If I wanted to play XI, I'd go play XI. Even though Abyssea exists, the old world still is there.

This whole system comes down to player choice. Be PL'd or don't. But don't try to force everyone to play your way.

Myself and most people I know feel no sense of achievement when getting a class to cap, just relief that it's over. Sense of achievement comes from things like -- using XI as an example -- finally equipping that Rajas Ring.

If someone needs more than a month to learn how to be a tank, damage dealer or healer, then their problem can't be fixed by a game.

I'm not sure what else to say that hasn't been said dozens of times already, this is not going to end well. I'm so very, very disappointed. My trust in your judgment has wavered, sir. :/

If this PLing works with Disciples of the Land and Hand, as well (Stone Throw/Wrist Flick to tag mobs) then this game shouldn't even be called a game anymore. You can rest assured I'll be pending my resignation should this be the case.

While I agree DoH and DoL shouldn't get SP from killing mobs, I do hope they have something in store to give them avenues to gain levels that doesn't involve grinding recipes ad nauseum.

[Davorok]

While I agree DoH and DoL shouldn't get SP from killing mobs, I do hope they have something in store to give them avenues to gain levels that doesn't involve grinding recipes ad nauseum.

Hmmm...how about grant R50 DoH the ability to cast "Hasty Hand" on another crafter? Forget having any semblance of an economy for lowbies, just Plvl crafters to cap so they can make end game gear.

[Nabiri]

XI felt like a place to me. A place with much adventure and many interesting people. A journey that lasted years. I gained things and grew as a character slowly over time. Attaining things (like gear and access to areas) along the way because they were fun, not because I was in a hurry to get anywhere or collect stuff. I didn't need or want to rush to endgame because.. well, it's the "end." I don't see a point in obtaining things to make yourself better just to obtain more things.
I felt more purpose in leveling up jobs and helping others and doing many interesting missions like Promyvion.


XIV is starting to feel more like a game than a place to me. A game where you do things only to get more things. And once you have those things... well.. you're done. There is no journey really.

That's a problem for me.

[Dargoth_Draconia]

XI felt like a place to me. A place with much adventure and many interesting people. A journey that lasted years. I gained things and grew as a character slowly over time. Attaining things (like gear and access to areas) along the way because they were fun, not because I was in a hurry to get anywhere or collect stuff. I didn't need or want to rush to endgame because.. well, it's the "end." I don't see a point in obtaining things to make yourself better just to obtain more things.
I felt more purpose in leveling up jobs and helping others and doing many interesting missions like Promyvion.


XIV is starting to feel more like a game than a place to me. A game where you do things only to get more things. And once you have those things... well.. you're done. There is no journey really.

That's a problem for me.

What XIV is starting to feel like for you is not even close to what XI felt like for me, even though I played the game for years it was almost like a career. FFXI was my job and I had to log on at certain times and do certain things because those things were expected of me as a player in FFXI. Felt like a minimum wage job at that at times. I still loved the game and still go back and play it from time to time because it did have a good formula for keeping you interested and always wanting to achieve the next level of greatness.

FFXIV is in a changing process right now and the reason it just feels like a game right now because it is just that, it is a beta test for a game that we haven't even really started yet. There is no end game content yet, I don't really count the current NMs and the Darkhold because that is simply the tip of the iceberg of things to come. I think by the time this game is pay to play it will have everything it needs to be a successful MMO. Even though for me honestly neither XI or XIV captured a true Final Fantasy feel for me.

[Seif]

I have to side with N. Yoshida on this one.

In skill based games like Monster Hunter hunting with people who are clearly better than you is really enjoyable. XIV is purely stat based but I hope these class tweaks will let them introduce some skill to the gameplay too and through that the help of better players will become more fun instead of just a form of cheating.

[indira]

Naoki Yoshida same fate as Tanaka soon??

[Coombah]

I can see the rage threads comming .....bring on fast leveling.. and world claiming !

[Roaran]

I don't understand how this could be anything other than an improvement.

One of the biggest problems with claiming, only being able to claim one monster at a time, is being solved. Initial claim still determines who recieves the rewards, the only difference is other players being able to help.

I don't see how people can even bring up the idea of MPK'ing being a new problem considering this new system changes nothing that regard. Enemies will still run back to their territory, and if you happen to be in the path, you can expect to be aggro'd.

Then there's powerleveling... which has been in the game since launch... The only difference being, you can now kill multiple enemies at once.

This entire thread is made up of people complaining about ideas they don't fully comprehend, and if you have the time to COMPLAIN about an idea, you might also have time to UNDERSTAND an idea and realize that you may have fewer tears to shed.