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  1. #1
    Player
    FrejyaAthenes's Avatar
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    Nov 2014
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    Character
    Freyja Alfodr
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Eloah View Post
    Every job in the series differs from itself in some way from each entry to the next, depending on how the game is structured. But there is always one key aspect that stays the same, and for summoners that is having a summon.
    ...
    You have to look at whether the job embodies the main aspect of itself, and in this case Summoner does.
    The difference here between the current summoner and the Summoners of old is the importance placed on them. Rydia, Dagger, Eiko and Yuna were all hybrid summoners, but their stories and gameplay still had an emphasis on their summoning abilities. Here the story attempts it, but it falls flat when in gameplay your still just an Arcanist with Fester and uglier familiars. Your skill/worth as a summoner isn't based around the power of your summons or the control you have over them, but your ability to place DoTs and keep them up over the course of battle while your summons just...float and do stuff of no concequence.
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  2. #2
    Player
    FrejyaAthenes's Avatar
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    Freyja Alfodr
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    Cactuar
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    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Eloah View Post
    And lastly, having Egis in this game makes perfect sense within the games lore. If you think about it the Primals are formed by a massive amount of "people" "praying" to the god to summon them, their power and size dependant on the amount of people who summon them and the aether used to give them a physical form. That being said, your summoner is ONE person, who is able to give the aether a physical form. Could SE adjust the size of the Egis, maybe make them a bit bigger, but having the smaller versions makes sense if you think about how the actual Primal is summoned.
    Out of curiousity, how far are you in the Manderville questline?
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  3. #3
    Player
    Eloah's Avatar
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    Jan 2015
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    Gridania
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    Character
    Toki Tsuchimi
    World
    Siren
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by FrejyaAthenes View Post
    Out of curiousity, how far are you in the Manderville questline?
    If you are refering to Enkidu, I don't think that counts as an Egi/Primal, that's still debated even within the context of the side story. Plus look at the size of Enkidu compared to Gilgamesh, he is still smaller. And Gilgamesh is huge, gotta think he counts as more then one person for some things, like summoning a "Primal"..
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    I like helping people with their Job ideas, it's fun to help them visuallize and create the job they'd like to play most. Plus I make my own too, I'll post them eventually.

  4. #4
    Player
    FrejyaAthenes's Avatar
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    Nov 2014
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    Freyja Alfodr
    World
    Cactuar
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    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Eloah View Post
    If you are refering to Enkidu, I don't think that counts as an Egi/Primal, that's still debated even within the context of the side story. Plus look at the size of Enkidu compared to Gilgamesh, he is still smaller. And Gilgamesh is huge, gotta think he counts as more then one person for some things, like summoning a "Primal".
    I see what you mean. However, whether or not Enkidu can be considered a "Primal" (I feel like after Mogglemog and Shiva the term lost all meaning) but more on the fact that Gilgamesh, ONE person who is not even a mage, let alone one trained in summoning arts, manages to conjure up a being far more powerful and impressive than any single adventurer or even Tristan managed to. It's more than a tad insulting.
    As for size, I don't care too much about them being full on Primal-sized. Personally I'd prefer them to be more player-sized depending on who they are (Ifrit could be Au'Ra sized, Titan Roe-sized, Garuda elf-sized, etc...).
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  5. #5
    Player
    Eloah's Avatar
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    Gridania
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    Toki Tsuchimi
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    Siren
    Main Class
    Scholar Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by FrejyaAthenes View Post
    The difference here between the current summoner and the Summoners of old is the importance placed on them. Rydia, Dagger, Eiko and Yuna were all hybrid summoners, but their stories and gameplay still had an emphasis on their summoning abilities. Here the story attempts it, but it falls flat when in gameplay your still just an Arcanist with Fester and uglier familiars. Your skill/worth as a summoner isn't based around the power of your summons or the control you have over them, but your ability to place DoTs and keep them up over the course of battle while your summons just...float and do stuff of no concequence.
    I do agree that the gameplay can fall a bit flat, since Summoners are just Arcanists with Fester. Hopefully this will change with Heavensward, having more abilities sould diversify them a bit more and make them feel a bit more Summon oriented. One change I would like to see is automatic ability swapping, depending on the pet you currently have out. I control my summons, on both Summoner and Scholar, but I use the expanded hotbar, since the pet hotbar is annoying. Anyway, I am only able to use Garuda and Ifrits abilities, not that Titans are needed right now, because each ability is seperate, but they all share specific cool downs. It would be nice if theabilities I use automatically changed depending on the pet I had out. I suppose I could try to macro them, but I see a lot of potential issues there.

    One other thing to consider is this is a game with a Job System, and any game with a job system doesn't place an importance on the summons. All of the characters you mentioned are from games where the summons are intrigal to the story as well as the character(s), but those stories don't have jobs in them. Now I know 14's story has the Primals as a focus but they are only a story element not a charcter one. Games like 4, 6, 8, 9, 10, and 13, all have the summons as a character focus too. Now I never played 11, so I can't say anything about it, but I'm guessing summons were more of a side story and not character focused, similar to how it is in 14 right now.

    Oh, also, on a tangent, while I understand why you put Eiko on that list, should she really be included? True she was a Summoner race wise, but she was oriented towards White Magic over Summons. But I suppose that could be me nitpicking. 9 is my favorite in the series.
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    Last edited by Eloah; 02-28-2015 at 04:37 AM.
    I like helping people with their Job ideas, it's fun to help them visuallize and create the job they'd like to play most. Plus I make my own too, I'll post them eventually.

  6. #6
    Player
    FrejyaAthenes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2014
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    Limsa Lominsa
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    Character
    Freyja Alfodr
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Eloah View Post
    I do agree that the gameplay can fall a bit flat, since Summoners are just Arcanists with Fester. Hopefully this will change with Heavensward, having more abilities sould diversify them a bit more and make them feel a bit more Summon oriented. One change I would like to see is automatic ability swapping, depending on the pet you currently have out. I control my summons, on both Summoner and Scholar, but I use the expanded hotbar, since the pet hotbar is annoying. Anyway, I am only able to use Garuda and Ifrits abilities, not that Titans are needed right now, because each ability is seperate, but they all share specific cool downs. It would be nice if the abilities I use automatically changed depending on the pet I had out. I suppose I could try to macro them, but I see a lot of potential issues there.
    Agreed. I've been saying that summons should be treated as a stance system where having specific summons out grants certain buffs/abilities. Maybe someday.
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