Thread: [dev1016] Post 1.20 HQ Crafting

Originally Posted by Radiator

Id like to see this system over the current system which is way too random. They should keep, +1,+2,+3 and reward the higher quality (number) you reach with a greater chance at +2, or +3. That way people at or below the level still can make +1 or even +2 but higher level crafters can still make majority +2 and +3. Needs to be some kind of reward for higher levels crafters or whats the point. It is quite annoying to collect a ton of HQ mats and get quality to 500+ and still NQ.

The point of being a high level crafter is to be able to craft high level recipes and repair high level gears. HQs should be available to everyone who dedicated time to gather the HQ mats and who is level appropriate to craft the gear/item. High level crafter should not equal HQ crafter.

Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

The point of being a high level crafter is to be able to craft high level recipes and repair high level gears. HQs should be available to everyone who dedicated time to gather the HQ mats and who is level appropriate to craft the gear/item. High level crafter should not equal HQ crafter.

I think we are on the same page here, but maybe not. My example would be Engraved Bhuj, level 32 Goldsmith. A level 32 Goldsmith could be garaunteed a HQ+1 by getting HQ mats. If they get their quality rating high enough they could get a +2 or even possibly +3 (however unlikely). They would be limited by the quality gain however. At a higher levels you would increase the amount of quality you could put into the sysnthesis and thereby increase your shot at +2's and +3's. Im sure there are going to be diverging opinions here, but thats mine and what Id like to see.

Originally Posted by Radiator

I think we are on the same page here, but maybe not. My example would be Engraved Bhuj, level 32 Goldsmith. A level 32 Goldsmith could be garaunteed a HQ+1 by getting HQ mats. If they get their quality rating high enough they could get a +2 or even possibly +3 (however unlikely). They would be limited by the quality gain however. At a higher levels you would increase the amount of quality you could put into the sysnthesis and thereby increase your shot at +2's and +3's. Im sure there are going to be diverging opinions here, but thats mine and what Id like to see.

Pretty sure they are doing away with +1 +2 +3 and just have NQ or HQ, mainly for inventory reason and also not to have a over complex system which doesn't alway rhyme with fun.

So yes for the level 32 GLD being able to craft a "HQ Engraved Bhuj" if he crafts with all HQ mats if that recipe is possible to make at that level, which I'll assume it is.

The "HQ Engraved Bhuj" will be usable (hypothetically since maybe not all gears will be upgradable) to make let's say a level 50 GLD piece of gear, not a "HQ Engraved Bhuj"+2 but another item altogether. If you use your "HQ Engraved Bhuj" with other HQ mats for that level 50 recipe, then you'll get a HQ Unknown Item level 50.

It's a way to reuse old items and also make for a prosper economy. Old items are still usefull at higher level so that new crafters can sell their items to old players. So the level 32 GLD who just made a "HQ Engraved Bhuj" can sell this to a level 50 GLD who is trying to make something else with it. Basically, finished items because mats in upper tier of crafting which like I said is perfect to generate a good economic balance.

Edit: which is way superior to the current HQ process where you need to outrank the recipe by a lot and by such enriching the high level crafters more and more while the new players / mid level players are suffering from this because things are more and more expensive and they can't keep up.

Current crafters life: "Hmm i want to make a HQ doublet", off to the market wards i go buy the mats (or farm them), try to make but... only NQ . Never mind let me try this again, two or three attempts go by. BAM! HQ!

So not only has this crafter put money in to the economy they have also put 4 new NQ doublets in to the wards for non craftes to buy.

Yoshi's crafters life: "Hmm i want to make a HQ doublet", off to the market wards i go buy the HQ mats (or farm them), try to make and... BAM! HQ!

So this crafter put money in to the economy but the by-product of NQ gear isn't there. the crafter isn't going to make/sell NQ stuff (even more so for low lvl gear), and if they make more HQ gear other then the piece they made for them selfs it will be out of the price range of the casual player.

Both these example are going to be hampered by the same HUGE flaw in the game, "the market wards". i'd still pick option one though. it's better for the game over all.

So what if it takes a few attempts to get a HQ verson, this is no diffrient to killing a NM for a piece of gear that may or may not drop, or winning or failing a raid, Do you really want everything to be 100%?

Originally Posted by Okiura

Current crafters life: "Hmm i want to make a HQ doublet", off to the market wards i go buy the mats (or farm them), try to make but... only NQ . Never mind let me try this again, two or three attempts go by. BAM! HQ!

So not only has this crafter put money in to the economy they have also put 4 new NQ doublets in to the wards for non craftes to buy.

No, this is how it goes:

Hmm, I want to make a HQ doublet. Oh, wait, I'm not 20 ranks above the recipe, so I can't. I'll just go buy it from the wards instead.

Yoshi's crafters life: "Hmm i want to make a HQ doublet", off to the market wards i go buy the HQ mats (or farm them), try to make and... BAM! HQ!

So this crafter put money in to the economy but the by-product of NQ gear isn't there. the crafter isn't going to make/sell NQ stuff (even more so for low lvl gear), and if they make more HQ gear other then the piece they made for them selfs it will be out of the price range of the casual player.

Both these example are going to be hampered by the same HUGE flaw in the game, "the market wards". i'd still pick option one though. it's better for the game over all.

So what if it takes a few attempts to get a HQ verson, this is no diffrient to killing a NM for a piece of gear that may or may not drop, or winning or failing a raid, Do you really want everything to be 100%?

You forget that NQ gear has cheaper materials than HQ gear and this is key. Cheapness of materials is what will keep NQ gear competitive. The flaw with the current system is that a low rank crafter cannot compete with a high rank crafter because they turn the same materials into different products.

Originally Posted by Okiura

this i's just have to disagree with mainly because the question will be "why make an NQ item for a 10k profit whin i can make a HQ item for a 100k profit in the same amount of time?" so the HQ mats cost more not a issue when you know the outcome is going to be a HQ item.

Edit: As for making items out of the random mats cottected during normal game play, if it's good SP do it and NPC keep retainer space for the high value HQs. if it not good SP the just NPC and NQ mats.

I kinda get this but you need to think of the big picture. Not everyone will be able to afford HQ gears or HQ mats to craft HQ gears even if it is more profitable. So there will still be a market for NQ gears for the average player who is low on gils. The rarity (as stated by Yoshi-P) of the HQ mats will make it so that it is rare and valuable to gather and craft the HQ gears but the majority of the mats available will be NQ.

People will grind on NQ gears so there will always be a market for that, new people and people with less gils that need a new piece of gear might buy a NQ gears until they can craft or afford a HQ one. So there will be a market for both NQ and HQ gears.

Sure if you can afford the mats to make your HQ gear, you won't bother with NQ stuff, but there might not be the HQ mats available to buy. So NQ mats and items will still sell at a good rate for an affordable price, HQ mats and gears will sell at a slower rate because they will be rarer and more expensive.

Originally Posted by Okiura

i Played FFXI for 10 years, i was a dedicated crafter i have to say you are defently correct in this statement, the only exceptions was when it came to endgame gear you would spend 200k on mats a NQ would be worth 20k and a HQ 500k. this is the way it should be too. that was endgame for crafters, huge risk vs huge reward.

Other than high demand consumables, almost everything I ever crafted in FFXI sold for a loss. The profit margins were so squeezed that only HQ could fetch a price over break even for almost every synth. Sometimes even high turnover items (meat mithkabobs come to mind) would occasionally dip into profitless territory unless you got HQ for an increased quantity per synth.

Originally Posted by MariyaShidou

The Dodore Doublet is r50 Recipe. I'm interested in whoever make that HQ Dodore, because he's a hacker by being r70 Leatherworker!

And I made a Banneret Lance +2 (R50 Recipe as well) at R44. That's the main reason why I lag out grinding Goldsmith after that, because I already get my goal without having to reach cap.

So you got insanely lucky and managed to +2 your lance. It happens in a heavily randomized system. R50 recipes are somewhat reliably HQable for R50 crafters if you have HQ mats and that's fine. I never said there was anything wrong with how crafting works for high rank items. However, because of your ability to almost guarantee high grade HQ on low to mid rank recipes, you could easily monopolize those markets.

Let's assume consumables start doing something and they pick up a lot of demand. There will probably be a R30 consumable that sells at rather high volumes, however, people who can barely make that item won't be able to participate in that market, because HQ crafters will be much more cost efficient and can afford to squeeze margins far beyond what NQ only crafters can manage.