Thread: [dev1016] Post 1.20 HQ Crafting

Originally Posted by Okiura

the price of gear atm is crazy i can't agreee with you more there, but i think the reason for this soley rest on the current situation with the market wards, if i make a item and in my mind is worth 5k (mats + a little somting for me) i will sell it for 5k and it normally sells pretty quick, sadly most people will never see that i sold that item for 5k and will reluctently pay the 20k or more other ppl are charging. this could be due to no fault of thier own who's to say what i item is really worth. the lack of any kind of price history is by far the biggest issue with the economy atm prices will never drop if the adverage joe is lead to beleive that the high prices are the norm and noone ever sells the same item for a lower price.

Yeah, unfortunately that is another matter entirely however it does impact directly on the crafting system. I have no idea what was the concept behind a MW, I hate when they try to hard to make something different. Auction houses have been around in online game for like ever... why? cause it works.

But the price history is not really necessary. Look at a game like WoW, there is no price history and the AH works very good. I liked the history of prices in FFXI though.

Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

But the price history is not really necessary. Look at a game like WoW, there is no price history and the AH works very good. I liked the history of prices in FFXI though.

WoW works cos it's a AH system lol. i have no idea what SE was smoking when they invented market wards. i remember the 1st time i logged in to XIV went in the the wards and went "Wow a dedicaited place for player to bazzar, no more loitering in upper jeuno/rollanberry fields. what a good idea bravo SE" then i went looking for a AH, i was a little shocked when i found out the the MW was the AH lol.

Originally Posted by Okiura

WoW works cos it's a AH system lol. i have no idea what SE was smoking when they invented market wards. i remember the 1st time i logged in to XIV went in the the wards and went "Wow a dedicaited place for player to bazzar, no more loitering in upper jeuno/rollanberry fields. what a good idea bravo SE" then i went looking for a AH, i was a little shocked when i found out the the MW was the AH lol.

That is what I thought it was too, a place to put up bazaars. I know the MW is not like an AH but you can still search an item and see the going price for it so it's almost like an AH, just less convienient since you got to move from place to place to buy your thing and then go back to the item search.

It's not THAT bad really now that I think about it lol... the function is the same as an AH, you just have to run from retainer to retainer to buy your item. no? The inconvenience is when you want to put things up to sell, you can't search from your retainer and have to go back and forth.

An option when you click on the item while in the bazaar function of the retainer to "search similar item" would solve that I think.

Originally Posted by tymora

I think they didn't mention anything about removing failure.

They haven't. You can still fail your recipe. 100% HQ if you do succeed, but you can still fail.

Originally Posted by tymora

[Problems I see]
1) NQ materials will take the place of "worthless" immediately. On the bright side however, they can be used to cheaply rank up even if the end product is not worth anything.

Sorry, Tymora, I don't mean to pick at you specifically, but I've seen this brought up several time, that the NQ items would be worthless, whereas HQ items would be worthwhile. Under the current system this is true, however, you are neglecting a brand new factor being introduced : MATERIA!!

NQ mats won't be worthless, since they are used to make NQ gear, which is turned in Materia by performing activities with it. Materia is the final step in making an HQ item top-tier.

Let me contrast
Current system, from best to worst:
1) Item +3
2) Item +2
3) Item +1
4) Item NQ

Proposed system, from best to worst:
1)Item HQ with two materia
2)Item HQ with one materia
3)Item NQ with two materia
4)Item NQ with one materia
5)item HQ
6)item NQ

Above may vary based on relative strengths of HQ of item vs. strength of materia. Regardless, there WILL be uses for NQ finished items, and hence uses for NQ materials. How much? That remains to be seen.

I just wanted to take a moment to point out the gross exaggeration in frein's example of needing to be 20 ranks higher than a synth to hq.

A skilled crafter can synth things above or on par with their current rank and still have a chance to HQ. The likely hood of the higher tiers of HQ are slimmer because they require such a higher level of quality. As it is if a crafter wants to make a high tier hq meaning a 2 or a 3 they can either be significantly higher than the level required to synth and they can crank out the quality because their actions are very likely to be successful, OR they can weigh the odds in their favor by starting with higher quality materials.

Skilled crafters can HQ regardless of their starting mats, but the starting mats increase the odds in their favor. I personally see nothing wrong with this.

My issue with these changes are very much the same issues I had with the first announced change of doing away with refined parts.

They don't fix the inherent issues in the system. They aren't fixing broken aspects to make crafting better, they are changing things just to change things. And this is what has me so confused about people who see the planned changes and cry Manna from Heaven! because these changes don't address the real problems with crafting... they are just arbitrary changes that in all likelihood will cause more problems than they solve.

The high level crafters who aim to crit for profit are still going to do it. They will still be able to charge exorbitant rates for their high level HQ synths. This change won't suddenly mean HQ items are within the reach of everyone, because the people who aren't willing to grind through the ranks of crafting will still largely be unwilling to do it.

Like Sorel, I am largely on the fence about these changes. But the main issue that keeps jumping out at me is most of these fixes are intended to fix things only obliquely related to them. Namely, the economy in general, and the market wards.

I think they are changing too much at once and not necessarily in the right places. And I can understand the standpoint that it's more cost effective to implement alot of changes at once rather than a few over time. But Materia is going to impact the economy in a huge way, as will all these planned crafting changes. Implementing them both at the same time is going to cause a huge mess of data that they aren't going to fully understand. I'd much rather see them introduce materia first and see how it effects the current economy and then plan out how they will change crafting based on the new standard materia creates.

Right now they are working with alot of conjecture, and frankly... I think most of the conjecture is flawed.

updated info from Yoshi-P check it out!

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post308948