Why Speed Pulls?

[Sousoulsu]

Since you do a huge pull, Mana will regen before you do the next huge pull if you keep out of combat properly.
It is empirically superior to speedrun than it is to single-pull, if we're talking just pure Healer damage potency.
Not to mention the competencies of other party members' AoE.

10 is also a relatively conservative number; depending on dungeon. Obviously the benefits of speedpulling vary from dungeon to dungeon ,but it's never not good to speedpull if you're capable of it.

[Sousoulsu]

Now, let's look at the same scenario, 10 mobs, and see how RoT spam goes:
RoT potency=100. Ignoring the thing in common with the two methods (HT->RoT), let's look at how many RoTs you can do before you're at 200-250 TP.
14.
15670 potency on 10 targets with the RoT spam method.

It's clear that, being a skilled DRG, you will be able to tell when you should RoT (spread out mobs) or when you should Doom Spike(properly packed/LoS'd mobs by a competent speedrun tank).

RoT spam is not the way to go.
I do, however, think that a mix of RoT and DS is the best idea

all of the above about DRGs is, of course, irrelevant unless you need gear in that dungeon, because BRD BLM SMN and WHM are better AoE than a DRG. I just took the time to math it out to you to prove a point.

[Kaiser-Ace]

Snip *3

Again I point out if you're relying on MY AoEs then you were screwed before you got there, This is not a matter of numbers it's a matter of practicality, I can use HT+RoT combo and Consistently hit more targets with more damage than DS. And something you are forgetting, prior to 2.4 DS was weaker than a Non-Comboed RoT which is why it fell out of rotation. And it still messes up my rotations as, even though it's not required for the combo, my chaos thrust combo still does extra damage from the rear.

If there are more than 4-5 mobs I don't trust Doom Spike to hit them all. Mobs don't just stand there, they move too. Now after the horde as been thinned and now that DS has been buffed it is now worth the 160 TP hit the last few mobs into the ground with now that they're heavily wounded.

I still don't think any of you "Number Worshipers" have actually put the time into understanding the job as I have as not only a dedicated Melee DPS but a Carrier Dragoon on top of it. There are some things you just can't learn by copying a rotation pattern. If it was all patterns and rotations then why would we even need parties to run dungeons at all? Just let us rent NPCs for places and never speak to each other. (I still remember how unfriendly 1.0 was just before it's ending.)

[Sousoulsu]

[Snap]

I posted numbers as a matter of principal. Realistically, a DRG in dungeon content is a hinderance. However, making lemons out of lemonade is what DF is all about.

And something you are forgetting, prior to 2.4 DS was weaker than a Non-Comboed RoT which is why it fell out of rotation. And it still messes up my rotations as, even though it's not required for the combo, my chaos thrust combo still does extra damage from the rear.

You are, to put it bluntly and simply, wrong. It is irrelevant if a move fell out of rotation: It was buffed, and is now optimal damage per GCD/TP cost - and CT doing more damage from the rear has no bearing on AoE. It is entirely irrelevant to the subject. I have no idea why you would bring it up, unless you don't understand that Doom Spike's potency is multiplied by a number equal to the number of enemies it hits.

If you have trouble hitting the optimal amount of mobs with Doom Spike, that is your failing as a player. I do not "main" DRG. I play it occasionally though, and I have no trouble with hitting the amount of mobs that would make DS worth using over RoT.
Of course, it relies on situational awareness. On some pulls it is not possible to optimally DS, and good DRGs will know the times when to DS and when to RoT. But I have not found it problematic on most big pulls to do the method I mathed out as superior.

You seem to think of yourself as an exceptional player, but from what I've seen you post, the most I can really say is that you are a mediocre Dragoon.
You tout yourself as a "Carrier DRG", but all you're really doing by saying that is proving how meaningless that self-stated title can be.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

And yet would you believe there was once a time someone was instant kicked from a dungeon (Brayflox HM to be exact) PURELY because he was a Dragoon?

I could hate speed running purely for that reason alone, but there's still plenty of reasons besides.

[Sousoulsu]

And yet would you believe there was once a time someone was instant kicked from a dungeon (Brayflox HM to be exact) PURELY because he was a Dragoon?

I could hate speed running purely for that reason alone, but there's still plenty of reasons besides.

I was once kicked from a dungeon for not using Regen on every party member.
is that a valid reason to hate anything aside from those particular misinformed people?

Go ahead and list your reasons to "hate" speedrunning.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

I was once kicked from a dungeon for not using Regen on every party member.
is that a valid reason to hate anything aside from those particular misinformed people?

Go ahead and list your reasons to "hate" speedrunning.

Nope. I won't list them, but I will list why I won't:

1. It's none of your business.
2. I've said just about all I need to say on the matter in nearly every thread that's ever existed about it ever.
3. The aforementioned reason lies less with the speed running itself (which I've already mentioned I find boring - this contradicts #1, I'm aware) and more with the negative impact it's had/caused on the community in general.
4. I don't intend to debate with you as we're likely to not agree on the matter. Ever.
5. Plenty of the valid points already made are in line with my own reasons.
6. See #1, #2, and #5.

[Sousoulsu]

Nope. I won't list them, but I will list why I won't:

1. It's none of your business.
2. I've said just about all I need to say on the matter in nearly every thread that's ever existed about it ever.
3. The aforementioned reason lies less with the speed running itself (which I've already mentioned I find boring - this contradicts #1, I'm aware) and more with the negative impact it's had/caused on the community in general.
4. I don't intend to debate with you as we're likely to not agree on the matter. Ever.
5. Plenty of the valid points already made are in line with my own reasons.
6. See #1, #2, and #5.

What you say in this post is that you have no response to my inquiry?
Why even post in the thread, then? What you posted is effectively spam.

[ThirdChild_ZKI]

What you say in this post is that you have no response to my inquiry?
Why even post in the thread, then? What you posted is effectively spam.

Oh believe me, it took 12 pages, I think, before I even finally worked up the energy to respond here. Again, see #2. This isn't the first thread about this. This isn't even the fifth one. And this isn't even the tenth time I've said/am saying exactly what I'm saying now. So let me at least try to make it somewhat interesting this time around:

No, you don't get the satisfaction of a counter-argument. I'm not going to bother giving you reasons - factual or opinion based - to attack or dispute. Keep the numbers and the rationalization. Seen it, heard it, still hate speedruns. No matter which class. And frankly, that seems like more of a problem for you than it is for me. I'd wonder why, but I have about as much interest in that as I do speedruns.

[Talia_Hailwind]

SLOW AND STEADY WINS THE RACE!