Why Speed Pulls?

[Sousoulsu]

Nyew may nyot be in a rush, but the three others in nyewr group may want to get it down quick.
If nyew arenyot comfortable, shouldn't nyew become so after running the dungeon 20 times?
If nyew are in a group of people who want to pull one pack at a time, then it's a nyan-issue, but that is rarely the case.

As a healer, it is mindnumbingly easy to heal a soldiery-geared tank through every dungeon available in the game. As a tank, it is boring to hit my area-aggro tool a couple times and 1-2-3 things until they die in single pulls.
The only thing that makes dungeons remain fun is speedfasts. I donyot understand players like you because there seems to be no initiative or willingness to perform anything above average.


Maybe it would be better if people were to describe why they are uncomfortable with speedfasting. I am very interested in their reasoning; since none has been purrovided as far as I can see.

[Brill_]

Maybe it would be better if people were to describe why they are uncomfortable with speedfasting. I am very interested in their reasoning; since none has been purrovided as far as I can see.

It's not that I am uncomfortable, it's just that 50% of the time there is a wipe. When you wipe, you lose the time savings you would've gained by doing big pulls. Slow and steady wins the race.

Even if we don't wipe, you typically just shaving 5-7 minutes off the run. If being in a dungeon for additional 5 is that painful, I'd have to ask why you are even playing the game if you hate that much?

If the time difference between a speed run and normal run was say a 20 minute run vs a 60 minute run, I'd completely agree, but it's not. The difference is negligible.

[Sousoulsu]

It's not that I am uncomfortable, it's just that 50% of the time there is a wipe. When you wipe, you lose the time savings you would've gained by doing big pulls. Slow and steady wins the race.

Even if we don't wipe, you typically just shaving 5-7 minutes off the run. If being in a dungeon for additional 5 is that painful, I'd have to ask why you are even playing the game if you hate that much?

If the time difference between a speed run and normal run was say a 20 minute run vs a 60 minute run, I'd completely agree, but it's not. The difference is negligible.

When you have to do 10 average dungeons for a zodiac weapon drop, it shaves off a lot of time.

Honestly, the "50% of the time it's a wipe" thing makes me think you're not capable or comfortable with the pulls. Even half of a speedpull is fine. I just hate it when poetics geared tanks do single or double pulls. It's extremely boring.
I actually can't remember the last time I failed a speedpull with a PUG while I was healing or tanking.

What some of the speed runners are saying is that it is boring to pull single groups. Just like you say here. What some of the non-speed runners are saying, and I will use mostly your words, my words included in BOLD:
As a tank, it is boring to hit my area-aggro tool a couple more times and 1-2-3 things until they die in single multi- pulls.
Seems like as the tank, you are doing the exact same thing.

Your lack of experience with speedfasts is showing.
Tanking a speedpull and tanking a single pull is different in the following ways:
1)Managing cooldowns is important
2)Knowing what cooldowns your healer has is important
3)Shield swiping certain mobs makes some otherwise impossible pulls possible
4)managing aggro during the pull is important to make sure your re-stoneskinning healer doesnt get hit
5)picking which targets to get rage of halone debuff up on is important

It is far more engaging to tank a speedpull.
There's more difference in speedrunning and single-pulling than "just do more of the same".

[Mykll]

I am not one that is comfy with speed pulling as a tank. Or being the very talented Healer that does a lot of DPS. I am just not. But I will try to do some on both sides. But, I do see both sides of this argument.

Slow pullers say (yes, exceptions):
I play the way that is comfy to me so that I enjoy it.
Speed runners can use PF.

Speed runners say (yes, exceptions):
I play the way that is comfy to me so that I enjoy it.
Non-Speed runners can use PF.

Umm, yeah...

As a tank, it is boring to hit my area-aggro tool a couple times and 1-2-3 things until they die in single pulls.

What some of the speed runners are saying is that it is boring to pull single groups. Just like you say here. What some of the non-speed runners are saying, and I will use mostly your words, my words included in BOLD:

As a tank, it is boring to hit my area-aggro tool a couple more times and 1-2-3 things until they die in single multi- pulls.

Seems like as the tank, you are doing the exact same thing.

[Tyrn]

Why would you not want to be as efficient as possible?

I have no clue how people can have fun taking it slow in 4 man dungeons when they've already done them 30 times prior.

Sadly there's a lot of people in this game who frown upon actually trying to play their role well and refuse to to contribute to the success of the party beyond the absolute bare minimum required of them to not be considered afk leechers.

[Velox]

On a related note for this discussion, the community has to stop saying "well the tank sets the pace of a dungeon." That is not true at all, and the more people continue to say it, the worse the playerbase becomes.

The PARTY sets the pace for every instance.

[Sousoulsu]

On a related note for this discussion, the community has to stop saying "well the tank sets the pace of a dungeon." That is not true at all, and the more people continue to say it, the worse the playerbase becomes.

The PARTY sets the pace for every instance.

When I'm able, as healer, I force the tank to speedpull by pulling the next pack while they're flashing the one pack they pulled.
They get mad but everyone else in the group seems relieved.

It's a general community consensus, which means people should purrobably get used to speedrunning, or take their own advice and form up "slowrun" parties :3c

[RaizeGraymalkin]

On a related note for this discussion, the community has to stop saying "well the tank sets the pace of a dungeon." That is not true at all, and the more people continue to say it, the worse the playerbase becomes.

The PARTY sets the pace for every instance.

They say it because it's true. When I DPS the dungeon I follow their lead. If they go slow and steady I respect that and follow suit. If they wanna go guns blazing and pull everything I'm cool with that too. I'm not going to force anyone to do anything they don't want to. I'm certainly not gonna go pull additional enemies the Tank hasn't yet. That's just an asshat move, I've been seeing more of lately.

[Kaiser-Ace]

The Key to pulling is the team work phrase from the DPS Creed, "No faster than the tank, no slower than the healer".

It's all team work. I don't care for fast pulls any where with the exception of Bryflox HM. But if I pull the whole first floor and we wipe to trash mobs I'll pull half that the next attempt. If I'm in Satasha HM or Snow Cloak and the other members say "Fast pulls plz" all I ask is "Sure you can handle it?" and when they say yes I simply go "Ok" and pull by the floor instead of by the pack.

Remember this is an MMO not a CoD Deathmatch. You're on a team that co-operates to succeed. And unlike CoD if one part of the team breaks down you all fail. The tank sucks? Every one dies. The Healers Suck? Every one dies. The DPS Suck? The tanks and healers get overwhelmed and, you guessed it, every one DIES.

Honestly, if every one started acting like a TEAM instead of 4-24 solo acts this game would be a lot more enjoyable for every one.

[Geist]

The Key to pulling is the team work phrase from the DPS Creed, "No faster than the tank, no slower than the healer".

It's all team work. I don't care for fast pulls any where with the exception of Bryflox HM. But if I pull the whole first floor and we wipe to trash mobs I'll pull half that the next attempt. If I'm in Satasha HM or Snow Cloak and the other members say "Fast pulls plz" all I ask is "Sure you can handle it?" and when they say yes I simply go "Ok" and pull by the floor instead of by the pack.

Remember this is an MMO not a CoD Deathmatch. You're on a team that co-operates to succeed. And unlike CoD if one part of the team breaks down you all fail. The tank sucks? Every one dies. The Healers Suck? Every one dies. The DPS Suck? The tanks and healers get overwhelmed and, you guessed it, every one DIES.

Honestly, if every one started acting like a TEAM instead of 4-24 solo acts this game would be a lot more enjoyable for every one.

Agreed, one hundred times over. I'm impressed at the overconfidence some of the above posts exude - the game wasn't simply made to be steamrolled over, or at least, it takes capable people over glitzy gear to wade through certain places. It also takes mutual enjoyment, a feeling of actual teamwork.

Pulling other mobs before the tank and the others are done might be a quick way to deal with the trash, but the party must be capable of dealing with the added threat and damage, especially if the mob ends up being a trick one, bringing in additional reinforcements or requiring quick repositioning to avoid nasty dots and damage. If your group as a whole isn't able to communicate and coordinate, it will mean a wipe or a slowdown as everybody scrambles to deal with a changed battlefield.

Like Kaiser above said, it's not about coming out as the smartest in the bunch or the last one standing, it's about making it through together - while, hopefully, having fun in the process. We walk the same dank dungeons and frozen wastes: "the way that works" has more to do with overcoming differences and cooperating according to the team's resources and limits. And regardless of what I'm playing at the moment - tank, dps, healer - I expect most players to be capable of reaching that kind of understanding.

Sorry for the long rant, just my two gils.