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  1. #1
    Quote Originally Posted by Karen_Cerfrumos View Post
    Enrage timer is there as the accountability check for DPS. Otherwise you'd go in there with 5 tanks and 3 healers and turtle all day.
    Conflags, Titan Egis, and Bees in T6 are good ways to do DPS checks, you don't need a hard enrage to prevent turtling.
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  2. #2
    Player
    kyuven's Avatar
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    Sep 2013
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    Ul'Dah
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    2,130
    Character
    Chen Kotomi
    World
    Adamantoise
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    Archer Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by SendohJin View Post
    Conflags, Titan Egis, and Bees in T6 are good ways to do DPS checks, you don't need a hard enrage to prevent turtling.
    Of special note, though, is that most fights with DPS checks ALSO have hard enrages.
    Hard enrages are sort of necessary to keep fights tight and encourage dps to do more than dodge and hit a few buttons on tougher fights. You need the gear, skills, or both to meet the enrage timer, which is in reality just a simple time limit on the fight itself to nip situations like Pandemonium Warden and Absolute Virtue in the bud in terms of length, and to mitigate the viability of carry groups. Of course it doesn't eliminate carry groups at all, but in order to do so you actually have to be damn good at the fight to be able to manage it while down a DPS
    It also means you're guaranteed about 6-8 full attempts on a given boss at a minimum.
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  3. #3
    Player
    lololink's Avatar
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    Jul 2011
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    Nel Artux
    World
    Asura
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    Gladiator Lv 80
    Quote Originally Posted by SendohJin View Post
    Conflags, Titan Egis, and Bees in T6 are good ways to do DPS checks, you don't need a hard enrage to prevent turtling.
    Except that you can't really put only add DPS check all the time, it would feel the same too much, DPS check is not only to prevent turtling but to prevent too much raising that would ruin some mechanics( although FCoB have a lot of death punishment T10 with the stacks and failure punishment move, T12 where the boss get buffed when people are dead, etc... )
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  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by lololink View Post
    Except that you can't really put only add DPS check all the time, it would feel the same too much, DPS check is not only to prevent turtling but to prevent too much raising that would ruin some mechanics( although FCoB have a lot of death punishment T10 with the stacks and failure punishment move, T12 where the boss get buffed when people are dead, etc... )
    you answered half your own question.

    Conflag isn't an add, neither are Titan Gaols or am i reading your first sentence wrong? you can also have mechanics like the Captain in Sastasha HM, where he keeps shooting you until you do enough damage to make him stop. not every DPS check has to do with Adds. Heaven's Fall is kind of a DPS check, i've never cleared T9 without skipping the 3rd Heaven's Fall.

    it's not super difficult to make things progressively harder for lower DPS groups without a hard enrage. increase the number of Tumults as the fight gets longer. add a 4th and 5th Ifrit to charge across the screen. Shiva already gets damage stacks over time, eventually staff mode will kill you, why do you need a hard enrage in that fight?

    the longer the fight the more damage the group takes but it shouldn't be an instant amount of damage that really good healers can't makeup for at least for a short period.

    ---

    you can't have PW/AV because the Trial itself has a timer, that should be the only hard enrage.
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  5. #5
    Player
    Gardes's Avatar
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    May 2012
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    Sileas Goode
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Culinarian Lv 51
    Quote Originally Posted by SendohJin View Post
    it's not super difficult to make things progressively harder for lower DPS groups without a hard enrage. increase the number of Tumults as the fight gets longer. add a 4th and 5th Ifrit to charge across the screen. Shiva already gets damage stacks over time, eventually staff mode will kill you, why do you need a hard enrage in that fight?

    the longer the fight the more damage the group takes but it shouldn't be an instant amount of damage that really good healers can't makeup for at least for a short period.
    So...punish the healers for the dps's short comings?
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