Fenrir

[axemtitanium]

A long time ago, people used to refer to the lesser moon Dalamud as "Menphina's loyal hound".

[Anonymoose]

After all there are more Behemoths than the one in Courthas and more Chimera than the one in Cutter's Cry

Possible, but when the word is used mid-sentence, behemoth and chimera begin with lower-case letters, so does siren, whereas Sickle Fang uses Fenrir.

No one seems to have ever gone there and lived to tell the tale

If I remember correctly, most (if not all) of the Circle of Knowing have been to the city-state of Sharlayan for study, which was in Dravania before they abandoned it and went home.

A long time ago, people used to refer to the lesser moon Dalamud as "Menphina's loyal hound".

I was so sure that this was going to end up being the basis for Fenrir, but I feel like if it wasn't just a coincidence, Fenrir would have been basically the Lambs of Dalamud's primal, in the end.

[axemtitanium]

I was so sure that this was going to end up being the basis for Fenrir, but I feel like if it wasn't just a coincidence, Fenrir would have been basically the Lambs of Dalamud's primal, in the end.

Seems like this Chekhov's gun... *sunglasses* didn't go off. (YEAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!)

[NoloeTazier]

Yeah, I was hoping so hard for Fenrir to be related to Menphina's Hound, after all why name a small moon a person of the Twelve's dog/wolf. Problem Moose, I have with the "spirit hound" thing is Fenrir doesn't die a unique death ala Diabolos. He just dies a boring old monster death. Though it's interesting with his attacks, Thousand Year Ilm and Lunar Cry. Thousand Year can easily coincide with the Dragon and Ishgardian feud, but what would Fenrir have to do with these dragons.

[Deifact]

"To repel the moon wolf, Fenrir... Somehow, your power appears to be genuine."

Basically Fenrir is Moon moon, which explains why he is so easy to defeat.

[DoctaruRavenbe]

Dammit Moon moon = -=

[Nalien]

I was so sure that this was going to end up being the basis for Fenrir, but I feel like if it wasn't just a coincidence, Fenrir would have been basically the Lambs of Dalamud's primal, in the end.

While the connection to the Lambs may have burned, I do think it adds something to the Primals = Twelve theories...

Menphina the Lover, wields power over Ice. Saint Shiva, the Ice Primal, perhaps maybe the Dragon Lover? We have Menphina's Loyal Hound and I'd argue we could call Fenrir Shiva's, or at least Iceheart's Loyal Hound given the reasons why we were fighting him... Crazy theory, we just discovered a new Archon - Iceheart is an incarnation Menphina...

Then again we'll be summoning Fenrir to ride, so perhaps he isn't that big a thing...

Then again we can buy Sleipnir, so maybe whoever keeps making new mounts just doesn't give a hoot about lore...

[Kaiser-Ace]

While the connection to the Lambs may have burned, I do think it adds something to the Primals = Twelve theories...

Menphina the Lover, wields power over Ice. Saint Shiva, the Ice Primal, perhaps maybe the Dragon Lover? We have Menphina's Loyal Hound and I'd argue we could call Fenrir Shiva's, or at least Iceheart's Loyal Hound given the reasons why we were fighting him... Crazy theory, we just discovered a new Archon - Iceheart is an incarnation Menphina...

Then again we'll be summoning Fenrir to ride, so perhaps he isn't that big a thing...

Then again we can buy Sleipnir, so maybe whoever keeps making new mounts just doesn't give a hoot about lore...

The Arcons aren't The Twelve. We've disproved that theory long before the Devs actually shot it down.

[Anonymoose]

I've had to withdraw from the primal discussions as of late just because I keep seeing everything through the lens of my current theory that the primals are literally the primal forces, (Inferno, Crag, Vortex, Gale, Levin, Frost - the six facets of Hydaelyn's light), and that all the entities we've been dealing with are just deiformed aether. I'm having a hard time not seeing it right now just because it explains too much. It explains why the essence of the land makes such strong entities; it explains why those were the first conjured until the laws of existence started to waver in the Crystal's weakness and suddenly anything you could zealously believe in could be deiformed; it explains the Twelve - each element given a polarity and named throughout the ages, associated with heroes of legend as tales pass from one age to the next.

It also explains why Moggle was so strictly not a primal until he was eh, pretty much the same thing, mostly, and why early trailers talked so much about myths made reality and the Land itself rising against mankind. Until I find something that collapses this house of cards, I'm stuck seeing everything through that lens, lol. Midgardsormr's association with Althyk and Nymeia suddenly being revealed to be the Earth and Water (or is it Crag and Tide?) of Hydaelyn didn't help me get back to seeing things objectively on that matter, either.

We see the essence of Frost harnessed by heretic zeal to manifest the deiform Shiva within Iceheart, and then that deiform summons soldiers from Frost that are themselves nothing like her, and nothing like Egi, either. Moreover, the first ice soldier was seen before Shiva was summoned (at least, either of the two times we currently know about). It all makes me very curious, and that's why I suggested earlier that perhaps Fenrir was an aetherial construct of Frost, as well. Carbuncle on crank, maybe. If that's true, it actually puts is back in the realm of possibility for connections to Menphina's loyal hound, though. Myth made manifest, no celestial objects required. Still, that seems like kind of a far-out way to write Fenrir into FFXIV...

</adjusts darksteelfoil hat>

[WyrahFhurrst]

I don't quite agree with that, Anonymoose, and the reason being Bahamut himself isn't an elemental primal, and he existed far before these six elemental primals did. If Odin's original form was a real person made into a primal then perhaps that shows more of a trend of primals being based on historical beings, and those primals based on real people surviving longer than the primals based on the natural forces.

That said, I wholly believe that the modern primals do certainly appear to be the natural forces deified, and I would like to propose that Bismark may be another aspect of wind that is not the Vortex/tornado. I think the reason we are dealing with elemental primals in the first place is because it helps with the Ascians' machinations to weaken Hydaelyn. By dividing the elements into individual forces they can make the "All made One" into the "One made Many" and open the way for their singular unified deity to take his place as ruler.