Job and Subjob system instead of classes?

[Khal_Drogo]

OP

The obvious other issue is, SE will have to carry the ongoing burden of working with 2 different systems all along keeping them perfectly balanced at all times with every new job, expansion and content added. More effort, more work, more resources, more complications, exploits, etc. As if SE needs more on it's plate in the current state of the game.

You're absolutely right, Gennosuke. I was willing to compromise before b/c I saw the potential benefits of having classes *and jobs, but now that you mention it....it's completely unrealistic. XI was bad enough with every new addition. They completely failed when it came to establishing balance. It was pretty much SAM, WAR, MNK, NIN, RDM, BRD, WHM, BLM -virtually, every other job was sub-par, and you couldn't ever get party invites on them most of the time. If SE had trouble keeping jobs balanced, how can they be expected to balance jobs *and classes... I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Why fix what isn't broken? XI had a really great job system. Some jobs were nerfed too much, and others were over-powered, but the general template of job and sub jobs was flawless.

[Khal_Drogo]

Solution: Go play FFXI. K Thx bi.

Why go play XI? They just released XI-2 this past September, or didn't you notice? Maybe the game title is throwing you off?

The way I understood it was that the new jobs are simply more focused play styles of the original classes. Monk being a specialty that you can earn as a pugilist rather than being a completely new job to level from 1-50(for example). That's how it came off to me in the battle reform blueprint anyway:



If that's the case then that takes care of some of your concerns up there. It doesn't seem as complicated & redundant when I look at it that way.

I wouldn't be very upset about that either probably. But, if they were going to do that, then lvl 50+ jobs should be restricted to the original design of XI: Job w/ sub *job. One job, one role, with 2 sets of traits/abilities at their disposal. A "SAM" with Cure IV, Chi Blast, Fire IV, Trunk Splitter, and so on, is the stupidest idea I've ever heard of -even if the spells/abs don't work well on the "wrong" job. Players shouldn't be allowed to equip the abilities/traits of each and every job/class they have leveled -it's retarded. And, regardless of what changes are made, this endless stream of tp, cure, enfeeb, and buff spam needs to stop. Slow the damn battle down...let us enjoy our kills.

[Zenaku]

Why go play XI? They just released XI-2 this past September, or didn't you notice? Maybe the game title is throwing you off?




I wouldn't be very upset about that either probably. But, if they were going to do that, then lvl 50+ jobs should be restricted to the original design of XI: Job w/ sub *job. One job, one role, with 2 sets of traits/abilities at their disposal. A "SAM" with Cure IV, Chi Blast, Fire IV, Trunk Splitter, and so on, is the stupidest idea I've ever heard of -even if the spells/abs don't work well on the "wrong" job. Players shouldn't be allowed to equip the abilities/traits of each and every job/class they have leveled -it's retarded. And, regardless of what changes are made, this endless stream of tp, cure, enfeeb, and buff spam needs to stop. Slow the damn battle down...let us enjoy our kills.

Same race so ffxi players could get use to FFXIV same layout of city once again for ffxi players to get use to it. Here where FFXIV stop being FFXI 2.0 class system and the overall way of playing is casual vs ffxi back before the dumbass 85+cap.

I hope ffxiv don't stay 100% casual forever.

[Engineer]

If jobs are not locked to the class that unlocks them, we will have kind of like a job/sub job thing, instead it will be a job/class thing... think about it.. so basically its Role/Weapon

examples..

Paladin/Gladiator
Paladin/Marauder
Monk/Pugilist
Monk/Lancer
Ranger/Musketeer
Ranger/Archer
Bard/Conjurer
Bard/Pugilist
Black Mage/Conjurer
White Mage/Conjurer
White Mage/Thaumaturge
Geomancer/Arcanist
Geomancer/Marauder
Red Mage/Conjurer
Red Mage/Gladiator
Corsair/Fencer
Corsair/Musketeer

ETC. (I didnt list all the Job/Class possibilities)

so basically its Job the class, role then weapon.. Mix and match any Job with any Class..

i think this will be realistically doable for SE, since this goes along the lines of what they have been devoloping..

[Zenaku]

If jobs are not locked to the class that unlocks them, we will have kind of like a job/sub job thing, instead it will be a job/class thing... think about it.. so basically its Role/Weapon

examples..

Paladin/Gladiator
Paladin/Marauder
Monk/Pugilist
Monk/Lancer
Ranger/Musketeer
Ranger/Archer
Bard/Conjurer
Bard/Pugilist
Black Mage/Conjurer
White Mage/Conjurer
White Mage/Thaumaturge
Geomancer/Arcanist
Geomancer/Marauder
Red Mage/Conjurer
Red Mage/Gladiator
Corsair/Fencer
Corsair/Musketeer

ETC. (I didnt list all the Job/Class possibilities)

so basically its Job the class, role then weapon.. Mix and match any Job with any Class..

i think this will be realistically doable for SE, since this goes along the lines of what they have been devoloping..

Pug= Monk no one else can be a monk but pug they said this before it lock by Class. They said later they going to add more Jobs for each Class and also be something like THM/CONJ= Red mage so you need both the class at a level range to become Red mage they said they thinking of this they may or may not do this part but the class lock per job yes they are.

[Engineer]

Pug= Monk no one else can be a monk but pug they said this before it lock by Class. They said later they going to add more Jobs for each Class and also be something like THM/CONJ= Red mage so you need both the class at a level range to become Red mage they said they thinking of this they may or may not do this part but the class lock per job yes they are.

Im not saying thats what they are going to do, im saying the idea would be more realistically doable than the proposed OP suggestion and would be similar to a job/sub job system.

Also let's face the fact that SE said that multiple classes will unlock certain jobs in the future IE. Thm+Con = RDM. If thats the case, then red mage can't be locked to one class because Thm and Con unlocks it. This is a huge hint that jobs won't be locked.

[Akashi]

I really wish they'd just copy and paste the system from FFTA. I have a feeling the current class system in FFXIV will do nothing but hold back what could be a nice thing.

[Keith_Dragoon]

I really wish they'd just copy and paste the system from FFTA. I have a feeling the current class system in FFXIV will do nothing but hold back what could be a nice thing.

I'd loooooove that!

[yukikaze_yanagi]

How can i explain me... no :|
1) it's too late
2)like this, we'll keep this classes as it for 6 moths at least
3)as i love'd ffxi, if i want a shameless clone, i'd just play ffxi. Let this game follow his road, ok ?

[Phenidate]

(So gonna regret this later)

As I said in the other thread, I am in favor of dumping classes for jobs, reason being: With no "classes" the weapon = class system can be done away with while still maintaining the armoury system's ability to cross-class abilities.

On another note a Job/Subjob system would probly be a better alternative to the armoury system. Before people jump on my back about taking step backwards and the likes I want you to read this. I don't mean the exact job/Sub system from 11 I was more along the lines of say you are soloing on Glad and you need some powerful heals to make life easier. Open your menu, goto jobs and change main to GLA and sub to CON you gain access to majority of the conjurer's abilities minus those that are not currently available. 1. (An optional text command for macros could be added) 2. (Players cannot job change while engaged as it is now)

"Well we can do that now without the menu!" Well in my proposed system we can equip other weapons because they ARE NOT our class, we can unequip weapons because they ARE NOT our class. in the system I proposed it helps better define your roles without pasting a job from a former FF ontop of XIV's current classes making things more complicated and a PITA balancing. Instead of balancing 2 sets of Class/Jobs they could spend more time doing other tasks that need attention.

With the current system in place Its hard to see this game getting many new classes/jobs in the future expansions. The wide array of jobs in 11 (20+) is what kept me around so long through the good and the horribly wrong.

I would like to see class - weapon binding dropped at some point. I suspect that, should they decide to drop classes to go ALL Job... they will wait a few months to a year in order to lessen the impact of suddenly dropping everyone's max rank classes in order to restart... That or a way to pick Jobs to convert one's classes to.