Thank you for the crafting changes

[Aeyis]

That's funny.. I thought it would have been obvious to anyone here that these are the items that are needed for this recipe for those who would start from scratch. But thanks for pointing that out for those who may not have noticed somehow. O.o

I don't think anyone was saying or implying that you couldn't go out and buy items or parts to jump ahead and finish this faster, (that is.. if you could find the needed materials/parts for sale).

Some people like to start from scratch. You don't like to? Fine. No one said they had a problem with you. I don't understand where your confrontational attitude is coming from over the fact that this recipe takes so many items to make from scratch.

I didn't create this recipe, so I'm confused about your need to take out anger (or whatever it may be) on me.
That "huge bloated immense list of garbage" I posted was something SE created, not myself. Take it up with them if it makes you upset enough to verbally attack someone.

"My" .. lol .. Again, you make it sound like I created this.. The list above has nothing to do with what I know about crafting. It's is just a full list of items that one recipe requires starting from scratch.
And I'm not sure what you thought I was summarizing.. I was only putting down my thoughts, not writing an essay. O.o But if you take pleasure in attacking people on a personal level, go right ahead. Shows what kind of person you are for the whole forum to see. :3

"Come back" you say? Oh not to worry, I'm not going anywhere. :3
"condense your list"? The point of posting the list was to show all the different items needed in that particular recipe from scratch. Condensing it would be misleading. I wouldn't want to confuse anyone.
Condensing the list wouldn't be from scratch now would it?
Ironic how you ask me to modify the list to make it shorter and at the same time accuse me of modifying it when I never did. :3

I was NOT posting misinformation. I posted what I said I would. The number of individual items in the recipe. Nothing more, nothing less. ^^

You mentioned starting from scratch and then proceeded to copy paste the entire crafting tree from yg without bothering to even look at what you just copied.

That entire list you posted has every single step in the process of crafting that final item in it.
Now tell me, whoever starts at scratch with the final components, middle components and early components all ready at start?

Yes i realised you ment from scratch, so did all the others that responded to you in fact.
It does seem that you just dont understand that the list you posted was not the materials need to start from stratch...
That's not called condensing, its called sumarising it to show the actual amount of items needed if one were to start from scratch.
You used your list of 37 items to refer to inventory blogging, when in reality if you were to start from scratch youd only need a dozen items orso.~

If you dont know about misinformation i suggest you google the defination and i think youll find it quite in tune with your list of 37 items.

Im not sure where you get the anger from xD but whatever.
Yes im being confrontational, but as someone who has always prided himself in helping out new players i take offense when people take such an obvious jab at trying to spread misinformation for their own perceived gain.~
Just cuz you want the system different doesnt mean you have to stoop so low you know?

[Nabiri]

You mentioned starting from scratch and then proceeded to copy paste the entire crafting tree from yg without bothering to even look at what you just copied.

I think you're exaggerating. I put the list down on a notepad, organized it and counted. Then posted the exact (unless I missed one or two items, although I did double check - and I wouldn't mind being corrected if I'm wrong), number of items to make this robe from scratch. Now how could I have done that without looking? ;3

That entire list you posted has every single step in the process of crafting that final item in it.
Now tell me, whoever starts at scratch with the final components, middle components and early components all ready at start?

It's not my business who does what. You do what you like, I'll do what I like, they (whoever "they" may be) will do what they like~. I don't know why the way other people choose to craft should bother you.

Yes i realised you ment from scratch, so did all the others that responded to you in fact.
It does seem that you just dont understand that the list you posted was not the materials need to start from stratch...
That's not called condensing, its called sumarising it to show the actual amount of items needed if one were to start from scratch.
You used your list of 37 items to refer to inventory blogging, when in reality if you were to start from scratch youd only need a dozen items orso.~

I understand perfectly well that the list I posted WAS the list of items to start from scratch. ^-^ And I'm still unsure why that makes you so angry. How about this, you can blacklist me and not look at yg at all, and be ignorant to that silly robe. Trust me, you'll feel better. (And it might prevent a vicious, fury-fueled robe burning spree later!)

If you dont know about misinformation i suggest you google the defination and i think youll find it quite in tune with your list of 37 items.

Yes, I know that word.
Which is why I don't understand what you're getting at. I posted a list of items in a recipe. I didn't change this list as I saw fit, or to trick others. The information was not incorrect to my knowledge. It was plainly the list. Nothing more, nothing less.

Im not sure where you get the anger from xD but whatever.
Yes im being confrontational, but as someone who has always prided himself in helping out new players i take offense when people take such an obvious jab at trying to spread misinformation for their own perceived gain.~
Just cuz you want the system different doesnt mean you have to stoop so low you know?

I'm not the habit of misleading people. In fact, I do all I can to get facts straight. If I'm wrong I don't mind being politely corrected. But no matter how badly you want things to be otherwise, that list is still the base ingredients in full for that one robe from scratch.
You can debate fact all day if you like. It won't make you look any smarter.

I'm not sure what you're getting at when you say "for their own perceived gain.~"
Did you think I had something to gain by the post I made, emphasizing how I really love and appreciate what SE is doing for us? If you see something there that isn't you have a strong imagination.

"Just cuz you want the system different"?

How did what I want come into this? I don't want anything.
If you missed the news, SE said that crafting is changing. Whether anyone likes it is up to them. I never stated what I want.
What I want is irrelevant. What the majority of the player base wants is relevant.

doesnt mean you have to stoop so low you know?

How DARE I stoop so low as to appreciate SE's hard work for us.. HOW DARE I!!! lol

To the OP, Kailea_Nagisa, I apologize if people, including myself, ~.~ are throwing your thread off topic. I will choose to ignore such inflammatory posts on this thread in he future. /bow
I would love to see this appreciation thread get back to where it was at the start. I hope SE knows that there are people out there who are thankful for their months of work and are willing to try out new systems to see if they're any good, before judging them. I look forward to the changes. It's gotten me more excited about crafting than ever. :3
Don't let the trolls get ya down!

[Zangetsu]

Why don't people understand that SE probably intends for us to focus on Materia instead of 10 parts to make one item. From the example they gave it looks like you have basic materials for it to visually makes sense. Just pretend your making buckles, straps, or whatever parts during the mini-game.

I think people also forgot what Yoshida said in his most recent letter. Here it is:

System-wise, MMORPGs are generally more complex than their offline RPG counterparts, and this is evident in the jargon they employ. In implementing the above changes in terminology, we wanted to make it so that at least the core aspects of the game can be easily grasped by anyone. We realize that more established players may find this change unsettling, and would like to apologize and ask for your understanding in advance.

[Wynn]

Why don't people understand that SE probably intends for us to focus on Materia instead of 10 parts to make one item. From the example they gave it looks like you have basic materials for it to visually makes sense. Just pretend your making buckles, straps, or whatever parts during the mini-game.

I think people also forgot what Yoshida said in his most recent letter. Here it is:

System-wise, MMORPGs are generally more complex than their offline RPG counterparts, and this is evident in the jargon they employ. In implementing the above changes in terminology, we wanted to make it so that at least the core aspects of the game can be easily grasped by anyone. We realize that more established players may find this change unsettling, and would like to apologize and ask for your understanding in advance.

Way to take that quote COMPLETELY out of context.

[Wynn]

That quote doesn't even have anything to do with crafting, he was talking about the removal of phys level and changing the term sp to xp and rank to level.

[OJtheLIONKing]

Another example of how this system has an overly high barrier to entry, and through that is negatively impacting the ability of new players (which this game needs) being able to get into the game.

I decided to get a new axe for my marauder, after using the basic bought one. Now I thought the NPC price for a Bronze War Axe was a bit high, so I decided to try to make an axe myself. my blacksmith's at level 18, so it should be no problem right? So let's see, I need Animal Glue, an Elm Axe Haft, Bronze Axe Butt, a Buffalo Leather Strap (Black), and a Bronze War Axe Head (which I already made a few weeks ago for a guild task, a process that itself took a few tries because it's a level 18 recipe even though the axe itself is a lvl 5 one). I have Animal Glue, so next is the Elm Axe Haft.

Woops, no Elm Axe Hafts on sale, looks like I need to make that too. I'd better make it with Lumbercraft. My weathered saw is in kind of bad shape and I've already failed a few lumber recipes I probably should have succeeded at, so I look to buy a Bronze Saw to make that axe haft.

Woops, too bad there are none on sale, and the next lowest one is selling for 200k, and so forth until the first one I see for under 100k is too high for me to be able to repair with my blacksmithing, so I'd need to wait who knows how long to get it repaired or pay 30k for repairs when it quickly breaks with my underleveled Carpenter. That's fine, I think, I can just make a Bronze Saw first. It's only a level 10 recipe.

Woops! There are no Ash Saw Grips on sale, so I wonder what it'll take to make that? Level 17 carpenter? i can't make that! And that recipe also requires Iron Rivets and Iron Nails in its components, which are several levels higher than I can make with blacksmith. These, at least, are on sale for a reasonable price, the first material I've seen selling for less than 30k+ in this process.

I'll stop here before this drags on for even longer, but this is the trouble I end up going through to make one, level 7 weapon that someone might need a day or two after he starts playing. Although these are now sold at NPCs, I know I didn't have 18k when I hit rank 7, and even so that's not considering upgrades to armor, and I've already run into situations where the next weapon upgrade I need isn't sold anywhere.

Hopefully by now, you see my point. This kind of thing has happened almost every single time I've tried to make something, and I usually waste a few hours trying to track down all these necessary parts before I give up. The system as it is is ridiculously and unnecessarily convoluted, nonsensical, and emphasizes existing problems with the market wards, not to mention my inventory is bloated with metal parts and materials I've kept just to try and prevent attempting to make an item and there being none of a certain item in stock. This has worked exactly once, when I was able to make a level 38 Bronze Celata, which is a rank 25 recipe for who knows what reason.

This, in turn, impacts the ability of players who want to craft but can't or don't want to spend hours tracking down mats for one item or spend months upon months leveling all crafting and gathering classes to avoid that and end up with completely overloaded inventories. Meanwhile, players leveling combat classes often can't get the logical gear for their class and level because it's never in stock, because not enough people are willing to wade through the morass of the crafting system to keep supply up.

The change was a long time coming and completely necessary for various reasons. I'm actually kind of mad about the implications that it will stay this ridiculous at higher levels, because that still has the problems that have been mentioned, only for gear that people need to stay competitive at endgame. Still, for now, this is a very good change.

tl:dr change is good, this change is good and should be embraced as part of getting the game back on track to be a success.

[CrystalObsidian]

Another example of how this system has an overly high barrier to entry, and through that is negatively impacting the ability of new players (which this game needs) being able to get into the game.....

tl:dr change is good, this change is good and should be embraced as part of getting the game back on track to be a success.

I have run into so many similar situations >.< It is quite a pain, and also why I'm happy to embrace the new changes.

[CrystalObsidian]

I love the changes as well!! I can't help but blame the many many ingredients required for my jobs like weaver and leatherworker is the cause for my crafting ranks to be low >.< Because I never feel like doing local leves, and I never feel like running all over Eorza to pick up "nails" and "brass buckles" for making some sort of LEATHER. o_o

I agree that high rank/rarer items should require more labor, but for normal and common crafts, these changes are very welcome!

[Kailea_Nagisa]

completely ignored the part where I said "made from scratch" buying anything from NPCs or ward is not scratch -.-

[darkstarpoet1]

completely ignored the part where I said "made from scratch" buying anything from NPCs or ward is not scratch -.-

i went through and put that if you wanted to you would need a whopping 5 extra items. i even conceded that the needing a leatherworker for the part that required the items i could see removing or replacing with something that is weaver only. i gave you a list of what you needed. you tried to make it look like rocket science when it is anything but that.