[dev1016] Systhesis Recipe Revisions

[Technolust]

The proposed changes are too drastic, while I am in aggreeance with some of the changes, I think that the system overall is being made to be to easy. Yes I like the fact that they are going to abolish most if not all of the parts, let me tell you why. Yesterday I wanted to make myself brass tassets, because I didn't feel like paying the 100k price tag for the armor.

Brass Tassets are a rank 21 ARM synth which requires:
Brass Plate x3
Brass Buckle x1
Brass Rivets x1
Oxblood-red Buffalo Leather x1

I had to switch to LTW and make the Oxblood-red buffalo leather with 1 Oxblood-Red Dye and 1 Buffalo Hide
I had to switch to GSM to make the 6 copper ore and 2 zinc ore into 24 brass nuggets
Had to take 15 brass nuggets to synth into 3 brass ingots.
I had to switch to ARM and synth 2 brass nuggets into 32 brass rivets.
Had to take 3 brass nuggets and synth into 12 brass squares
Had to take 2 brass squares and 1 brass nugget and synth into 12 Brass Buckles.

Are you still with me?
I then had to synth 3 Brass Plates, 1 Brass Buckle, 1 Brass Rivet and 1 Oxblood-red Buffalo leather into Brass Tassets.

But guess what? I failed because I had a destabilization right after the first standard use.
Then I had a
/wait Durability loss of 1
/wait Durability loss of 2
/wait Durability loss of 3
/wait Durability loss of 4
/wait Durability loss of 5
/wait Durability loss of 6
/wait Durability loss of 7

Then synth stabilized and boom failed.

Do you see what is wrong with this picture? I spent a good hour doing this all to just fail, yet I love to craft I understand sometimes you just fail but come on. You want to fix crafting, don't dumb it down and make it like XI's crafting.

Yes I agree the parts thing has to go, and go quickly.

Do you have to get rid of secondary skill requirements?
Do you have to get rid of synthesis support and the Treatise Requirements?
Do you have to dumb it down so much that a trained monkey can synthesis items in this game?
Yes dying should be easier I agree with that.
Yes I think a lot of the parts can be removed.

If you really want to fix crafting though for a lot of people.
Fix elemental destabilization.
Fix how many times I have to hit wait to get an element to stabilize.
Fix so when I'm rank 40 synthing a rank 2 recipe I shouldn't have any issues with elemental stablization.

[AlexNiculaie]

I think the idea behind the synthing system Tanaka came up with is fine. I enjoy the mini-game aspect, although I think it needs to be fine tuned to feel, iono, I guess faster. It feels like there is too much start and stop to it. If it felt a little more fluid I'd enjoy it more. My only problem with it was the imbalanced recipes.

[Akira_Tenshi]

You are playing a video game one called Final FANTASY. It doesn't have to be realistic. There is a little to much realism in this game for my liking.

[DexterityJones]

I posted this in the other thread, but since things seem to be staying on topic here, I will repost this here.



I think if they just addressed the issue of needing a part that was 20 levels above the level of the item you were trying to synth, cut out a few parts (which they've done) so you don't need to make 45 different synths before you could make the item you wanted and everything would of been fine.

I'm a crafter, always have been and like everyone here who crafts we can all agree that the system was flawed.

Yet most dedicated crafters enjoyed the complexity of the craft (I for one however do not believe high level parts and multiple synths before being able to do the main synth as complex, just tedious), even though there is the removal of parts, you still need to make some synths to be able to make the main item, just not as many!. So the reduction is wise.

Be that as it may, this is what is happening. I just don't really get where the heavy handedness is coming from in the

Removal of Crafting Facility and Treatise Requirements
As with secondary class skills, crafting facilities and treatises are virtually essential for current recipes. New recipes, however, will require neither at this point in time.

* Alternate uses are being considered for crafting facilities and treatises.
Why remove the crafting facilities? and bought skill books?

Access to the facilities allowed you to feel like a part of the guild, to see familiar faces and work away at the location, and get to know your fellow crafter, plus the boost is nice when you're on the cusp of a synth and afraid you might break it!
(With the introduction of airships and chocobos, the arguement that awwww I have to travel all the back to Gridanna to go to the leatherworkers guild, is now a moot point especially since these changes are coming at the same time as transportation)

Why the removal of skill books? DoW and DoM have their skill books, it allows you to work towards something and feel an acomplishment besides just ranking up; when that PITA recipe is now a breeze because you've studied up and learned how to cobble shoes better. It's no different than having to get your PUG or GLD marks to gain additional skills so you can be better at these respective classes.

Removal of Secondary Skill Requirements
Many of the current recipes have a secondary class requirement, forcing players to develop skills in multiple crafting disciplines. New recipes, however, will not require secondary skills at this point in time.

* In the future, it will be made so that players benefit from developing skills in multiple disciplines.

Why this? most DoW and DoM have to level multiple (some argue that DoW have to level ALL jobs) to become better at what they do, why should and how is it, any different for DoH? once again it provides a sense of accomplishment,that all that time the DoM/DoW spent raiding for gear to get better, is the same as all the time you've put into crafting alternate crafts so you could be better too.


Some of these changes make sense to me, (As stated) some, such as armour colour very welcomed (if done smartly so our alchemist buddies are needed too!), and I think overall the changes to the actual mechanics of the recipe making is fine, its just the quoted points I dont understand.

where Did SE think this was a good idea? It's almost as if they were listening to Joe blow FFXIV player who was pissed he can't do everything and needed to work at crafting just like he needs to work at raising ranks for DoW and DoM.

[AlexNiculaie]

I apologize. It wasn't my intent to start an argument.

I probably should not have quoted you because the generally negative nature of this forum probably made it seem like I was attacking what you said.

I highlighted what you said because it stood out to me.
I agree that most people would not want to spend hours every day making items. I personally would not either.

But I did want to offer the point that there are people who enjoy crafting more than any other aspect of the game.

Well I apologize in return as well. I knew people in XI that had multiple mules just because they loved crafting that much. And I do think that's great. I think there should be content that caters to people of any Class who want to specialize in those Classes. I just think the materials/time required should match the item being made.

To use a real world weaving example, if you are making a cheap pillow to sell, you're going to use four things; pillow form, 1 1/2 yards of material, 2 yrds welt and thread. you are going to use the cheapest materials you can. Less if you cut out the welt cord. But what we see in a lot of low level synths is the equivalence of trying to make a cheap pillow using 3 different fabrics, welt cord, fringe, a pillow form, and a zipper. Both "recipes" work, but the second is not cost effective to the item being produced. The second would be cost effective, however, for a higher value.

I am not against complex recipes; I am just for recipes to make sense for the items being produced. Both in time and materials.

[AlexNiculaie]

Yeah, I can agree that taking away the books and multi-crafting recipes seemed unnecessary. It's not as if they were a requirement on all that many items. And the more unique items should have additional necessities to make.

[Zion_Cross]

Change the crafting system.

[Noata]

I read this thread and was ready to jump on board, then i read what SE posted. It took me a little to realize the big picture. Since launch this game has had tons of issues and with the coming updates they are trying to fix alot of stuff. and somethings seem like a turn in the wrong direction. I think we should try the system before we go bashing it. I know the current system is realistic. However when SE first created this game they wanted a game that you could be a full time player or a every now and then player and still be able to move forward in this game. The limited leve system allowed this. and crafting was always appealing but required more work then someone who cannot devote hours of game time to the game could put forth. I think this new system is designed to make it easier for players to know recipes, to craft successfully and so the dye system they want to implement has its place. Since SE said they were going to let old recipes stay for a time. Think of this as a trial period. Right now SE is trying to complete this game for the console. With the aspiration of making the game successful they want to make it more friendly for first time playesr when the game finally goes to the PS3. lets face it, it took time to get used to the crafting system. Final Fantasy 14 is an ever evolving MMO that will under go major changes throghout its lifetime. The game is getting a full rework. Somethings are welcomed with open arms by the current players. and some are not. but SE will focus on the future more then the present right now this game is free. They are taking a big hit. Try to understand that some changes are being made to make the MMO successful, there are plenty of MMO's who have reworked there crafting system for Simpler methods. Everquest II, WoW, Aion. The hard truth is that while hard core MMO players will love complicated systems, a majority of the population struggles to keep up. I hope you can take an objective view of this system and see SE is trying to make the game more successful at the cost of some well thought out systems. I am sure the devs dont like reworking the systems they worked hard to make.

[Rikuu]

I agree with OP 100%.

If they want to make the Crafting become easier, make it simpler isn't the way to go. The Crafting is awesome now and is close to be a masterpiece. If people doesn't like how it is, just play another discipline. I'm pretty sure most of people that loves crafting, it's because how it is NOW.

If they want to change the recipe of certain leves for make them easier and thus level up easier it's ok, but don't change the whole synthesis system.

I like the current crafting system, it is suitably complex, requires a bit of effort and most impotently makes sense.

+1

In my opinion, one of the distinguishing features of FFXIV was the crafting system. It was what made the game different from the rest and gave those of us who like crafting a challenge.

+1

[DNO]

All i have to say to this thread is this: (quoting what Yoshi said below)


"11. Would you welcome changes to FINAL FANTASY XIV that would drastically alter the rules already set in Eorzea?


It seems this question started a wave of panic among players about whether or not character data would potentially be wiped. For the definitive answer on that, please see my response to a player's letter below. As for the results, 85% of players answered in the affirmative. This is something that will be in the forefront of my mind when making decisions concerning future updates to the game. I promise to do everything in my power to address as many of the players' demands and desires as I can."


We all voted for drastic changes and here they are and i am happy.