o.O Overkill on the crafting Dumb down?

[DNO]

I believe that this will be a good thing for the game - as a whole. I haven't read the whole thread, but I did notice mention of Star Wars Galaxies and the NGE in relation to the changes. However, the crafting in Star Wars Galaxies was actually relatively simple - it was a host of different quality/types of materials and ability that went into creating good items. (As an example 'Radioactive' was one of the possible types, but it had various types and quality of material with different properties).

I don't think FFXIV will be going down that path. I do believe however that customisation of gear (creating if for certain classes for example) will make it so that rather than 'Crafting' being completely about the act of crafting, it will be much more about the market and selling of your goods. This is rather like gathering at the moment, as the entire game plan for it (if you are not gathering purely for yourself) is to make your time worth Gil, which you then obviously exchange for items in the end.

To be honest, I've never been into crafting in *any* game outside of Star Wars Galaxies, as too often it is a lot of work with very little feeling of having accomplished anything (in this, I can never quite make anything worth selling, in WoW etc nothing is worth selling until max rank, and even then...). My favourite thing is knowing that someone, somewhere has bought my stuff and is now using it. The idea of crafting sleeves isn't quite so exciting!

The other side I see to this, is lowering the number of different items that are floating about in the game and on your person. It is currently somewhat ridiculous to say the least (as a Rank 44 Botanist, I know some of the pain) - and this in turn means that you then have more space in your inventory for the things you want to keep.

I'm definitely going to give it a chance, I didn't believe that the combat changes were necessary, but already with the implementation of auto-attack and clearer aggro, I'm enjoying it a whole lot more. It's all part of the plan!

wow great post

[Chione]

Well. Here's my humble opinion on this:

Abolishment of Parts from Synthesis -Eh... No thanks. I actually liked seeing the little bits and pieces in the finished work, and this is from someone who doesn't usually craft finished items. Granted, I don't have any single skill very high. But I'm one of those apparently rare and mystical creatures that likes crafting bits and pieces. So, depending on what parts are being abolished, they could be taking out the very things I like to craft. So, I hope no one can blame me for being dismayed at this aspect.

Revisions to Materials and Intermediary Materials - Whatevers. No complaints, but no praises from me either here. I always thought some of the level gaps in parts and finished items were weird. But at the same time some were understandable. For example, making the sleeves and back and front of a garment is much more difficult than just sewing those completed pieces together.

Removal of Secondary Skill Requirements - Whatevers. Again, no complaints and no praises here. Sometimes a secondary skill made sense, and the only time it bothered me was when I had a leve with one of these recipes on it. I know folks say leves ignore secondary skills, but it sure seems like I have a devil of a time succeeding such synths in comparison to other like-leveled leves without them.


Removal of Crafting Facility and Treatise Requirements - Foolishness, SE. Foolishness. This is silly. Especially the treatise part. You're going to remove an aspect of the game that people spent time acquiring and saving guild marks for before you decide on a new use for them? How about you figure out a new use for them first, and then implement that instead of just robbing folks of their mark rewards.

Simplified Color Customization - Alright. I suppose I sound quite cynical at this point, but this change is okay. The way dyed items worked before didn't bother me, and I sort of liked being able to tell what sort of cloth it was by the color. But, I admit it took up a lot of space. Still, I kinda liked dyeing cloth and leather pieces. So, I'm not all that enthusiastic to see it go.

All in all, these changes are another in the current direction of the game that makes me wonder if I have place in the game's future. Not to sound all melodramatic or anything, but so far most of the major changes have done a number on a lot of the things that I enjoyed about this game. Luckily, I still find gathering fun. But I can't imagine sticking around on that alone, especially when DoL are treated like second-class citizens... but those things are rants for another thread.

If I were the rant-thread starting type, that is. :P

[syntaxlies]

Abolishment of Parts from Synthesis - BEST DECISION!
Revisions to Materials and Intermediary Materials - BEST DECISION!
Removal of Secondary Skill Requirements - BEST DECISION!
Removal of Crafting Facility and Treatise Requirements - BEST DECISION!
Simplified Color Customization - BEST DECISION!

Guys..stop whining and face reality.
The old synthesis system is toooooo much complicate.
It's too complicate enough to make new players give up on making something for them self.
Me too, I tried to make something ( like some armor ) to wear at low level..
After check YG and see all the material that need to craft that piece of shit... I gave up.

This new change will bring simplicity to all crafting and encourage new players to play this game.
This game need players so it can stay alive.
If it going like the old system, no one will stay ( my LS used to have 100+ people, now 0.. including me )

Please admit that the old system is poorly designed and need to change.
I know that it will remove "Reality" part of this game.
But we are playing "GAME" not "WORKING" so.... enough for reality..

people are so worried about reality in a game where we can carry 100 items in our inventory and of those items there are some that can stack to 99. Seriously, who can carry that much stuff. If you want you can carry about 10,000 items on you. Were is the reality in that. These are the same people that cried to increase stack sizes from 10 to 99 just throwing reality right out the window.

[Geesus]

people are so worried about reality in a game where we can carry 100 items in our inventory and of those items there are some that can stack to 99. Seriously, who can carry that much stuff. If you want you can carry about 10,000 items on you. Were is the reality in that. These are the same people that cried to increase stack sizes from 10 to 99 just throwing reality right out the window.

Touche ... touche

[Kokos]

Craftingsystem how it is right now is just PERFECT. Changings NO THANKS!!!

[Okiura]

Well. Here's my humble opinion on this:

Abolishment of Parts from Synthesis -Eh... No thanks. I actually liked seeing the little bits and pieces in the finished work, and this is from someone who doesn't usually craft finished items. Granted, I don't have any single skill very high. But I'm one of those apparently rare and mystical creatures that likes crafting bits and pieces. So, depending on what parts are being abolished, they could be taking out the very things I like to craft. So, I hope no one can blame me for being dismayed at this aspect.

Revisions to Materials and Intermediary Materials - Whatevers. No complaints, but no praises from me either here. I always thought some of the level gaps in parts and finished items were weird. But at the same time some were understandable. For example, making the sleeves and back and front of a garment is much more difficult than just sewing those completed pieces together.

Removal of Secondary Skill Requirements - Whatevers. Again, no complaints and no praises here. Sometimes a secondary skill made sense, and the only time it bothered me was when I had a leve with one of these recipes on it. I know folks say leves ignore secondary skills, but it sure seems like I have a devil of a time succeeding such synths in comparison to other like-leveled leves without them.


Removal of Crafting Facility and Treatise Requirements - Foolishness, SE. Foolishness. This is silly. Especially the treatise part. You're going to remove an aspect of the game that people spent time acquiring and saving guild marks for before you decide on a new use for them? How about you figure out a new use for them first, and then implement that instead of just robbing folks of their mark rewards.

Simplified Color Customization - Alright. I suppose I sound quite cynical at this point, but this change is okay. The way dyed items worked before didn't bother me, and I sort of liked being able to tell what sort of cloth it was by the color. But, I admit it took up a lot of space. Still, I kinda liked dyeing cloth and leather pieces. So, I'm not all that enthusiastic to see it go.

All in all, these changes are another in the current direction of the game that makes me wonder if I have place in the game's future. Not to sound all melodramatic or anything, but so far most of the major changes have done a number on a lot of the things that I enjoyed about this game. Luckily, I still find gathering fun. But I can't imagine sticking around on that alone, especially when DoL are treated like second-class citizens... but those things are rants for another thread.

If I were the rant-thread starting type, that is. :P

well said , but keep the sub crafts cos that just logical to be in line with the other clases like having to lvl CON for cure shell & protect for use on other clases

[Kiote]

So what you're saying is that, without parts you can't level easily? But I thought the crafters who are upset weren't looking for ease they were looking for a challenge? O.o So now, you have one. You can't just do what you use to anymore so find another way. Also, I doubt there aren't base mats that are needed at a higher rank that you can use to continue to level up on or as you said "practice thier skills on." i.e cotton bolls into thread and so on. I know that's low rank ...it's just an example.

What I'm saying is that these fixes do not FIX anything. They make leveling crafting harder without actually altering the method by which crafting is performed. Everyone know crafting needs to be fixed, but none of the "fixes" being implemented address the problem they simply dumb down the system and lower SP/hr

[Platinumstorm]

While I think the actual "crafting system" needs to be redone [I'd like a Tetra master style card game], my changes to crafting would include making the EXP curve much smaller but keep it difficult to craft items through material needs.

In the markets that are trivialized for materials you essentially get the same sale price on rank 10 items as you do on rank 50 items; and I worry about that result in the future.

[Melian]

Guys..stop whining and face reality.
The old synthesis system is toooooo much complicate.

That's not necessarily reality - it's mainly your take on it. Several people liked it.

I'm not the big crafting type, so I'll deal with whatever was done pretty easily because its impact on me will be minimal. I did like how ff14 treated crafting as a job you could go pretty in depth with though, as opposed to ff11 or mmo's from other franchises. I think the recipes where the parts had higher skill requirements than the whole were poorly set up, because it's frustrating to have to reverse synth like that. I think people would much prefer if you could do the parts while skilling, and end up using them on the whole. But I don't think everything needed to be stripped away.

Removing some of the 2nd requirements seems like a good move to make crafting more accessible. And the addition of a simple way to dye materials with a universal dye seems like a very wise time saver. So I'm on board with those two changes.

Someone explain why they're removing the utility of treatises though?

Edit: I /do/ get yoshi/the dev's point about the needed parts not always being readily available on the wards however. I was looking for several parts not too long ago, to make low level items for my new/remade character here, and had no luck finding them because no one made them anymore. The only present solution to that is to depend on others in your ls to make for you, or to level all of your own crafts. Having to level all your crafts is bad. Depending on others is good, although not necessarily in this way. It would be better to have to depend on other crafters who chose to put those parts in the wards. I think rather than abolish those items as parts of synths though, we simply need to find a way to encourage their placement in the wards. What way that could be, I'm not sure.

Then again, I'm no dev. I'm sure they thought about it a lot, and maybe this is simply the best solution there was to the issue of no one making parts for low level items and then selling them in the wards.

[Okiura]

Someone explain why they're removing the utility of treatises though?

cos it takes "effort" to earn GM's to increase you chances of success?