I fear for Summoner

[Dyvid]

I question for the hardcore SMN. How much of a DPS hit is it if you add Aetherflow > Energy Drain X 3 every 3 or 4 rotations? I did some test on Dummy and found that restores around 1400 mp with my current gear set.

[Akiza]

I question for the hardcore SMN. How much of a DPS hit is it if you add Aetherflow > Energy Drain X 3 every 3 or 4 rotations? I did some test on Dummy and found that restores around 1400 mp with my current gear set.

After 3 or 4 rotations a Hardcore Summoner will have around 800 MP which means they were ruin spamming while keeping up DoTs. It's around 150 dps over the course of an encounter.

[Lavieh]

After 3 or 4 rotations a Hardcore Summoner will have around 800 MP which means they were ruin spamming while keeping up DoTs. It's around 150 dps over the course of an encounter.

For my current gear, Each Energy drain is roughly a 8-10 DPS loss per use over Fester.

8.3 DPS loss if your fest is doing 1000 and your ED is doing 500

[Viviza]

I question for the hardcore SMN. How much of a DPS hit is it if you add Aetherflow > Energy Drain X 3 every 3 or 4 rotations? I did some test on Dummy and found that restores around 1400 mp with my current gear set.

I'm not a hardcore summoner but I'll throw some numbers at you. At i110 my energy drains hit for about 500 while my festers hit for about 1000. At three times a minute that's a difference of 1500 damage, so a loss of 25 dps in exchange for 798 mana. Those numbers are without using any buffs, not in a group, not using food, not including crits, and not with the very best gear. If we say that my DPS with all those would be maybe 50% higher, then the actual loss would be maybe around 35 to 40.

[Dyvid]

Well one key issue i just noticed on Energy Drain is that mp is a fixed value and not dependent on gear or damage done. Even when I critical for 700 it's 350hp and 266mp restore. That does need to be fixed.

[Viviza]

Well one key issue i just noticed on Energy Drain is that mp is a fixed value and not dependent on gear or damage done. Even when I critical for 700 it's 350hp and 266mp restore. That does need to be fixed.

Should it? Spell costs haven't gone up.

[Judge_Xero]

SMN's biggest damage comes from Fester, and I think that move is what the dev team needs to address. Up its potency, remove it from Aetherflow dependency (with an increased CD, obviously...20 seconds seems all right to me), add potency to it from Miasma II and Shadowflare applications; SOMETHING.

Fester is not actually a large part of SMN DPS. @ i110 it's only 50 DPS. Or around 14% of total damage (Depending on the encounter).

SMN just needs to benefit from gear more to bring it's total damage up.

A 7-10% increase would bring it to a great position.

[loreleidiangelo]

Fester is not actually a large part of SMN DPS. @ i110 it's only 50 DPS. Or around 14% of total damage (Depending on the encounter).

SMN just needs to benefit from gear more to bring it's total damage up.

A 7-10% increase would bring it to a great position.

Better gear returns could also work, though I admit I'm not sure how that's normally implemented in an MMO (without it affecting BLM, with whom SMN shares gear).

I still think that for a resource-dependent move Fester should just DO more. Especially when that resource is split between the only thing we have to keep ourselves sustainable.

[Orrias]

Fester is not actually a large part of SMN DPS. @ i110 it's only 50 DPS. Or around 14% of total damage (Depending on the encounter).

SMN just needs to benefit from gear more to bring it's total damage up.

A 7-10% increase would bring it to a great position.

Fester is the only thing that keeps your overall mean dps high. It provides a 'spike' in your dps -- without it, your dps (graphed) looks flat.

[Judge_Xero]

Better gear returns could also work, though I admit I'm not sure how that's normally implemented in an MMO (without it affecting BLM, with whom SMN shares gear).

They'd just need to adjust the damage equation for gear stats so that it scales the same as other classes.

For example. SMN damage increases 3% per magic damage stat. BLM increases by about 3.7%.

The pet gets about 6% per MD which combined with SMN equals out to a scaling of 3.75% so technically on par with BLM, except that the pet doesn't gain from secondary stats(except crit) and has a 3s cast time. So the % of pet damage has terrible scaling vs other classes too which throws off SMN even more.

So that's why people think just a potency/mp increase wont be a long term fix. The whole damage equation for SMN vs other classes and pet vs other classes and SMN + pet vs other classes needs adjustment.