Finally got through T5. Time to learn T6?

[Hyrist]

That's just it, though. There has to be abuse or harassment. Kicking a player that's holding the group back isn't abuse, especially if a basic explanation of mechs has been given and they aren't listening or just aren't getting it.

That's not for you or I to determine. That's for the GM to determine, and again, abuse of the system, which is can simply be ascertained by having enough reports against the individual for votkick abuse, is enough grounds for the GM or SGM to make the call.

It does not need to be simple abuse of a single individual. At all. While GMs have a rubric to follow, cases like that fall to their discretion (usually, the SGM or team leader would make the call). A person who's going to votekick abuse like that is going to get attention paid to them, and not of the kind they want.

And I don't play the skepticism game. I deal with facts and experience. Turn around on GM calls can be anywhere between that night to months later depending on the amount of investigation needed. When you are building a case of mechanic abuse behavior, especially as one on an area as contestable as votekick, it can take a while.


If you guys want to take these risks to enforce an imaginary standard that the majority of the game neither knows of or agrees with, do so at your own peril.

Speaking of averages, me and my fc went to t6 to help someone gear up his pld last week

Completely disqualified your argument. You came into the DF with the purpose of aiding someone, worked with those who were new to the mechanics, expected wipes, got them, and clears. You were willing, and able to, experiment with the players, regardless of their level of mechanics. Just so happened that they were competent enough to do the job.

On the matter of luck with Duty Finder, I have a FC member that rolls a 1 on a d20 so many times of late that it's become an expectation. That does not mean there are not another 19 sides it can land on just as easily. The idea is to go into DF expecting you're going to have to put some work into pulling the party together. It's the pretense of patience that matters.

Examples are being thrown around on how someone who has cleared T5 should have their mechanics down by T6 - but it doesn't account for things like Class changes. Someone who used to main DPS and got through Twintania may not be as good at tanking going into the DF, but did it because he was exasperated with DPS queues. They're likely going to need help on matters that some people are going to think they should have down by now. It does not mean they are a bad person or should be instantly kicked because of it. Especially when it comes the Duty Finder.

I swear, it shouldn't be so exasperating to tell people to be patient when dealing with randoms.

[Gardes]

This is why my Free Company makes it a concerted effort to assist all our members so they are not forced to resort to Duty Finder.

I swear, it shouldn't be so exasperating to tell people to be patient when dealing with randoms.

I don't know why you're preaching this hard about patience when you and your fc is already dodging the DF from the get go, either.

That's not for you or I to determine. That's for the GM to determine, and again, abuse of the system, which is can simply be ascertained by having enough reports against the individual for votkick abuse, is enough grounds for the GM or SGM to make the call.

And I don't play the skepticism game. I deal with facts and experience. Turn around on GM calls can be anywhere between that night to months later depending on the amount of investigation needed. When you are building a case of mechanic abuse behavior, especially as one on an area as contestable as votekick, it can take a while.

So basically there's no complete proof about what's going to happen to a player on any offense and what you claim as fact has been hear say from other players, despite there are hear say from other players that are the exact opposite. I still don't see how this makes it official that players going into a df MUST have the same mindset as the newcomers instead of expecting randomness from ALL sides (including a newplayer getting 7 other people who went in there to win) and expecting random outcomes of getting a win, abandon or getting kicked, especially when there's an actual gm reply posted in the forums stating that player removal over play style disagreement isnt something that gms are goind to do something about. Plus, the whole game community at large isn't even united on this front because someone just said that another data center treats the df differently.